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The Matrix: ReTarded Trailer

Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 10:55am

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jaycoolyea

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This is a trailer for an upcoming film titled The Matrix: ReTarded. it is, obviously, a Matrix spoof. the trailer features complex effects shots and multilayer compositing. it will be very worth your while to check it out.

More Info
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 11:54am

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Aculag

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Oooooookay! It'll be hard for me to say bad things about this, since it's a comedy, and maybe the bad things were intentional, however I don't think some were. For instance, some of the muzzle flashes were way too big, and the "stunts" all looked like you shot on a greenscreen handheld, and composited onto handheld background shots. So you get a really really bad "floating crazily" look to it. I hope these were intentional, but they're not funny anyway.
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 11:59am

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Rawree

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Well where to start. The audio levels for the speech was a bit low some of the time compared to the music and sound FX. The effects were applies well (The muzzle flashes may have been a bit too big at some points). The bit with the Architect made me laugh unlike some of the "Comedies" around here. The bluescreening wasn't anything spectacular or anything terrible but I'm willing to look past that as you may not have much experience with it. Overall it looks like you've thought about things and put some effort into the production. I'm looking forward to the full movie. I mean this in the nices posssible way (if it's real): The agent's haircut was the funniest bit!

Rawree
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 12:01pm

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owen rixon

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rite.....now that your work has been put down pretty harshly, I'll say a few good things, cause all out criticism and no positive comments can do no favours for your confidence.
The agent bullet dodge effect was really good....just like the 1 from the Matrix.
The transformation from the dead agent to the dead normal person was pretty like the 1 in the film too.
The fighting looked good.

I dont see why you needed to green screen some of the elements though. The one where the background is a few computer screens. Could that not just have been done with the actor infront of a few computer screens??
Anyway.....overall I thought you did a pretty good job.
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 12:11pm

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b4uask30male

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I think all 3 guys above me have said the same as what I would have said.
What is the full running time of the full version ?
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 1:06pm

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mod_007

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That was actually really good. I was entertained all the way through the trailer and I really liked the part with the architec, that was funny, and the part where they fly in the air shooting at each other. I would really like to know how you did that.

Overall, I give a 4.
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 2:58pm

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callum_slade

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good effects. Shame about the poor quality video though. It kinda spoilt it for me.
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 5:38pm

Post 8 of 75

anonymous

this trialer was shot over the course of 2 weeks, but we shot up to 1 day before the deadline. i had to edit this, composite, add effects, and render.....overnight. i will post a better quality, improved audio version shortly. plus, to get the full effect, you need to turn up the volume, since some audio is intended to be low (ex: whispers).

~jaycoolyea
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 10:01pm

Post 9 of 75

anonymous

Hi I'm the actor that is dressed as "Neo" in the movie. I just wanted to say that we are in the process of making the full length feature film, "THE MATRIX RETARTED". The script has been written and filming has been started. Hopefully the movie will be done in late Febuary or early March. Thank you,
Andrew
Posted: Thu, 29th Jan 2004, 10:10pm

Post 10 of 75

anonymous

gotta say, can't wait for the full thing! good stuff.
Posted: Fri, 30th Jan 2004, 1:48am

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MistahG

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callum_slade wrote:

good effects. Shame about the poor quality video though. It kinda spoilt it for me.
Posted: Fri, 30th Jan 2004, 4:46am

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Brettsta

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Just watched this, well done! I thought it was funny. Some of the effects needed some masking but it wasnt bad. I gave a 4. How did you do the agent dodgey thingy?
Posted: Fri, 30th Jan 2004, 6:25am

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jaycoolyea

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thanks for the positive feedback everyone.


the agent dodging bullets was done in adobe premier 6.5. i stacked on on top of the other, and did a mask key on each one. i had to tweak the bringhtness and intensity to make it work. i actually did that scene on location. i think it would have been much better, had i blue-screened it.

as for the masking, i had to edit this in one night, i just didnt have time.
Posted: Fri, 30th Jan 2004, 10:44pm

Post 14 of 75

anonymous

woo great work james.. . i know you couldn't of done it without me remember?! i clicked the mouse.. once? o well dont let these guys put ya down with there tech talk wat not bout ur graphics u did a kick azz job considering u made in less then a week!!! woo make the movie and spend time on this one : P
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 12:40pm

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stqagehanduk

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Half of your posts have disappeared overnight! Wow! All evidence of vote fixing has vanished into the ether, a la Twilight Zone! Did we dream it all? Spooky ...

I'm assuming that all those negative posts are off enjoying a picnic with the apology we're all not going to get. Speaking of which ... You've STILL rated yourself a 5. You don't honestly think you deserve that, do you? Parodies are lazy and easy, and a bit of graft on the special effects aside, the camera work is still poor and the whole thing screams "Nerd Pleased Wth Himself".


I notice that you've rated HOLED UP a single point now, as opposed to the original Zero. Well, thanks. All I can say is that my little movie enjoyed a couple of weeks in the top ten (including a brief re-entry) without any naughty effort on my part, whereas you had to cook the books for your five minutes in the sun. Did you learn ANYTHING from this?

Dear oh dear oh dear oh dear ... the boy hears but he doesn't listen ...
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 2:16pm

Post 16 of 75

anonymous

I feel sorry for you stqagehanduk. You're over 30 and a nerd...that's sad. Do something else rather than dis a bunch of teenagers. Just because you were a loser in school doesn't mean you have to be an ass to them. P.S. You're movie sucks!
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 3:44pm

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stqagehanduk

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Well, I thank you, Nameless Guest, for your sympathy. I do apologise. I was given to understand that the gentleman in question was, in fact, a discreet individual of 23 rather than a gestalt of children, and although he's since removed that description, had chosen to describe himself as "professional".

You see, I run a theatre company, although we've been a bit quiet of late, and I am, ultimately, responsible for everyone working for me during the duration of a show. I've taken the rap for a great many things that weren't my fault because that was my job at the time, and smiled while I did it. So although I have better things to do right now, I do feel that even if the vote-rigging that took place in his name isn't his fault it IS jaycoolyea's responsibility, and therefore the responsible (that word again!) thing to do would be to apologise.

I do have better things to do, but it does bug me. What can I say?

And on a final note: My movie sucks! Oh woe is me! This is worse than when I was a friendless loser virgin at school! You have cut me too deeply! Oh woe woe woe!
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 5:17pm

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Fight

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Rating: +1

Do retards flock to fxhome for any particular reason? Is it because it's so nice and shiny?

Sigh, I guess I'll never understand the majority of our nations mind states.
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 6:09pm

Post 19 of 75

anonymous

i could definately see why jaycoolyea might rate Holed Up a single point, or even a zero. because it is worth nothing more. Holed Up features faulty chromakey, cheesy CG, and utterly pointless plot. anyone who hasnt seen it, go there for a good laugh. stqagehanduk is the bald guy. by far the worst actor in the film. i think you're afraid of jaycoolyea. he actually knows how to put together a semi-decent film, while your horrible wannabe fanfilm poisons fxhome. i've seen fx tests that are overall better than holed up. spend your spare time improving your films instead of ridiculing others.
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 6:13pm

Post 20 of 75

anonymous

and i quote:

"Parodies are lazy and easy, and a bit of graft on the special effects aside, the camera work is still poor and the whole thing screams "Nerd Pleased Wth Himself".


now, lets see, Holed Up was not completely original, was it? its not like you attempted to spoof STAR WARS or anything. fucking idiot. before you try and make someone elses film look bad, examine your own first.

be thankful jaycoolyea removed all of the dumbass posts, you might look a little better, having them gone. all you;ve done is embarass yourslf by posting bogus shit on jaycoolyea's post.
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 9:44pm

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stqagehanduk

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Well, you've got me on the Chromakey. I had a deadline, I didn't light my screen properly and, voila ... still, Holed Up is my baby and I'm happy enough with her, faults and all.

I should point out that after years on stage I've had nastier and certainly far more articulate and better justified things said about me than I imagine you can muster, and in mass print too, so it all slides harmlessly off my shiny bald pate, like dirty rain.

After all, we all live and learn, don't we? Or do we?

Underneath the slew of insults - and I'm surprised that not one of you (assuming there IS more than one of you) has thought to go so far to suggest that, perhaps, I smell, or that I'm rather closer to my Mother than the laws of man or nature would allow - I can't help but notice that not one of you has actually addressed the point of issue. I'll say it again and keep it short and easy so as not to lose you!

Vote fixing bad. Apology possibly good idea.

And as much as I'd hate to get into a dubious and pointless "my film is better than your film" type argument, I will simply sate the facts again - I managed a lot longer in the top ten than you did, and I did it WITHOUT cheating. Ta daa!

Well, thats my lot for this evening. I have a paying deadline tomorrow, plus, of course, some envy and insecure fear to fit in! They're behind me! No! No! Noooo!
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 11:15pm

Post 22 of 75

jaycoolyea

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im done with this pointless argument. does anyone have any feedback over "the matrix retarded trailer?"
Posted: Thu, 5th Feb 2004, 11:56pm

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Aculag

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What do you mean, you're done with it? You had nothing to say about it other than that...
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 12:00am

Post 24 of 75

stqagehanduk

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Does "I'm done with this pointless argument" translate as "I have no intention of taking responsibility for my actions"?

I rather suspect it does. Incidentally, and this is possibly just paranoia on my part ... Doesn't Nameless Guest share your inability to capitilise the letter I and the beginning of sentences? Are you perhaps one and the same?

But you're quite right, in your way. No doubt you'll produce some more work here at some future point and promptly grant yourself five marks out of five - possibly six, if you can swing it. I, on the other hand, remain my own worst critic - which isn't bad given some of the competition, but, hey ho.

Please bear in mind that I'm not the only person irritated by your vote-rigging and your inability to even own up to it - even if the others have been edited out of existence and I remain the most persistent one with the biggest mouth. So don't do it again. Thank you and Good Night!
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 12:24am

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Brettsta

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You can go in the chat room and ask if it was him, which it was. Probably.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 12:46am

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jaycoolyea

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please give it a rest. i am really tired of putting up with this. i am not the guest. i apologize for any and all actions ever executed by jaycoolyea. all i ever wanted to do was get some advice on my film-making. i did not put my movie on this site to get in the top 10, or get any special recognition. at 11:00 one night, one of my crew members called me excitedly and told me we were number 9 on the top 10 list. i never even imagined our trailer could get that far. our film got to the top 10 without any voting on jaycoolyea's part. it was jaycoolyea's voting that brought my film to it's demise.

i got another call in 2 days. we were off of the top 10. my team was devistated. one of them (i now know who) went on here and voted 0 for the most vulnerable movies in the top 10, to get back on the list. it worked, but people caught on quickly.

since then, i have changed the password to jaycoolyea. nothing like this will ever happen again, i assure you. once again, i apologize for this entire situation, and take responsibility.

James Poole
jaycoolyea@earthlink.net
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 12:49am

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Aculag

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A very interesting situation. Thank you for apologising.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 12:52am

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Brettsta

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Thanks for apoligizing. I respect that
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 1:12am

Post 29 of 75

stqagehanduk

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And me. See! Now everybody loves you!
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:06am

Post 30 of 75

anonymous

this trailer was rated much better before the whole voting incident happened. Then everyone voted badly just b/c they were mad. I think we should re vote or something. I'm not even a member but if you can change your vote, i would.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:09am

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Brettsta

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You cant change your vote. People vote bad when people vote there movie super high. They get annoyed so they vote lower. Do you think its fair if your movie, because you raed it a 5 gets in the top 10, when other peoples movies, with honest votes dont. I'd wait and see what the average vote is. THen make your voting ddesicion based on that.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:15am

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jaycoolyea

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is it even possible to change votes? or does someone at csb digital have to do it?
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:19am

Post 33 of 75

Brettsta

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You can ask one of the CSB guys to take out your vote, and then redo it, or not.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:40am

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jaycoolyea

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"Do you think its fair if your movie, because you raed it a 5 gets in the top 10, when other peoples movies, with honest votes dont. I'd wait and see what the average vote is. THen make your voting ddesicion based on that."

my movie got into the top 10 without any of my voting. mine was rated higher in an attempt to stay in the top 10 a little longer. honestly, i know the hard work my crew and i put into this trailer, and i think we deserve a 5. that's just my opinion, im not trying to stir up conflict.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:42am

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Brettsta

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I think thats perfectly fine, but maybe you shouldve waited a bit if you know what I mean wink
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 2:51am

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jaycoolyea

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we were sorta desperate. we got off the top ten, and my crew tried everything to get us back on, which wasnt a good idea.
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 9:23pm

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stqagehanduk

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Given that 5 would imply professional quality ... do you REALLY believe you deserve a 5? Do you? I would have thought the whole point of putting stuff up here was to get other people's opinions, not to whack a gold star on your own work to show eveyone how clever you think you are.

I look at my own work and I see every fudge, mistake and bad decision, even when other people don't, and I think that's healthy. I get steadily better, and I hope always to. Do you really believe you have nothing left to learn?
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 9:31pm

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Aculag

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I think a lot of people voted accurately on this. I know I did...
Posted: Fri, 6th Feb 2004, 10:07pm

Post 39 of 75

stqagehanduk

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I tend to agree. I wouldn't have even given this a second look except for the whole you-know-what incident.

As far as low voting goes I'd normally defer to vote rather than vote really low. It must be disheartening. I have to say I wouldn't even dream of voting on my own stuff. It surprises me that anyone would. What's the point?
Posted: Sun, 8th Feb 2004, 8:27am

Post 40 of 75

anonymous

stqagehanduk, if you're just gonna bitch and bitch and bitch...then go somewhere else instead of posting and bitching. Go bitch at a movie that deserves it. Like i saw this one called "Holed Up". I don't know who made it but it's pretty bad.
Posted: Sun, 8th Feb 2004, 2:49pm

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Brettsta

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Anonymous wrote:

stqagehanduk, if you're just gonna female dog and female dog and female dog...then go somewhere else instead of posting and bitching. Go female dog at a movie that deserves it. Like i saw this one called "Holed Up". I don't know who made it but it's pretty bad.
I love the sensers hah. Guest, shut up. We know your ip :&rt;
Posted: Sun, 8th Feb 2004, 8:45pm

Post 42 of 75

stqagehanduk

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Thank you.

All I'm trying to say - and getting juvenile abuse for doing so - is that this site exists to showcase our work and to invite the comment and advice of our peers. Consequently the voting system gauges the general feeling and for any artist here to vote on their own work simply serves to distort that.

I wouldn't dream of voting on my own movies, simply because it wouldn't mean anything. I'd either come across as horribly conceited and arrogant assuming I don't anyway, of course ...) or horribly deluded in those instances where my audience diagreed with me wildly.
Posted: Mon, 9th Feb 2004, 3:59pm

Post 43 of 75

anonymous

bitch
Posted: Mon, 9th Feb 2004, 10:46pm

Post 44 of 75

jaycoolyea

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please guest, dont post unless you have something constructive to say.
Posted: Mon, 9th Feb 2004, 10:55pm

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Brettsta

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Anonymous wrote:

female dog
the sensors are hilarious!
Posted: Mon, 9th Feb 2004, 11:10pm

Post 46 of 75

CX3

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jaycool, is the guest somebody in your crew?
Posted: Mon, 9th Feb 2004, 11:12pm

Post 47 of 75

Brettsta

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It could possibly be, but I dont think so. There is always a guest giving crap comments to movies.
Posted: Tue, 10th Feb 2004, 12:21am

Post 48 of 75

stqagehanduk

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Well, I had previously believed that Guest and Jay were one and the same, but Jay has since proven pretty reasonable whereas Guest, well ...

But I say let him post. He can always be ignored and, heck, it's probably the highlight of his day.
Posted: Tue, 10th Feb 2004, 12:22am

Post 49 of 75

Brettsta

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stqagehanduk wrote:


But I say let him post. He can always be ignored and, heck, it's probably the highlight of his day.
Hah, yeah. Guests comments are often amusing just because of how dumb they are.
Posted: Tue, 10th Feb 2004, 5:33am

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Whitey04

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James told me that he's in the process of making a better quality trailer and will release it later this week. I can't wait. We will post it somewhere else so it can get a new rating than the bad quality one
Posted: Tue, 10th Feb 2004, 9:40am

Post 51 of 75

stqagehanduk

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What does "better quality" mean?

If it means higher resolution with less compression then it might have the opposite effect - to simply highlight the composition mismatches and those areas where the effects are particularly weak - the background monitors and the blood spurt, for instance.

If it means that he's going to redo great chunks of it then surely he'd be better off saving those lessons and that effort for his next project. Are the ratings of themselves really that important?
Posted: Tue, 10th Feb 2004, 1:06pm

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jaycoolyea

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i was rushing to finish the trailer, and in the process, i lost some of the rendered composites when premier has a 'fatal error.' i stupidly used preview files to replace the lost files, therefore, reducing the quality.

i'm going to re-composite the original footage and make the trailer over again. why? because i'm bored. we can't shoot the movie any this week, so this is keeping me busy. thanks for the feedback
Posted: Sat, 14th Feb 2004, 7:40am

Post 53 of 75

jaycoolyea

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stqagehanduk wrote:



If it means that he's going to redo great chunks of it then surely he'd be better off saving those lessons and that effort for his next project. Are the ratings of themselves really that important?
i agree, i'll just leave the trailer alone and work on the final version. that is what's important anyway.
Posted: Wed, 10th Mar 2004, 9:51pm

Post 54 of 75

anonymous

HAHAHAH! This movie looks very funny! You best make the full-length version!
Posted: Wed, 10th Mar 2004, 9:53pm

Post 55 of 75

Brettsta

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Guy wrote:

HAHAHAH! This movie looks very funny! You best make the full-length version!
Haha, a guest
Posted: Wed, 10th Mar 2004, 10:18pm

Post 56 of 75

CX3

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lol
Posted: Thu, 11th Mar 2004, 6:53am

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Bryce007

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stagehanduk, i dont really get why you are so worried about his scores, its not that huge of a deal, its over so just shut the hell up and quit being so overly concerned about stuff that doesnt matter anymore
Posted: Thu, 11th Mar 2004, 12:07pm

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stqagehanduk

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Where did that come from? I haven't posted here for a month.

But the answer to your implicit question is: Because I was initially irritated by the cheating and then, to compound that, I was further irritated by his unwarranted arrogance until that magical magical day he came clean and apologised. Case closed. Until you, anyway. I'm reminded of a joke:


At a Trappist Monastery once a year, it has been decided that the Monk who has proven most devout is allowed to speak one sentence over breakfast.

A year rolls around, and it's Brother Joseph's turn. He says, "I think the porridge is too hot."

Another year, and now it's Brother Luke's turn. He says, "I think the porridge is served too cold."

Another, further year, and this time Brother Simon speaks. He says, "I wish you two would stop arguing abouth the $£%£ing porridge!"
Posted: Thu, 11th Mar 2004, 11:09pm

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jaycoolyea

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the last time anyone posted about ratings was february 10, i'd say it's over. thank god.
Posted: Fri, 12th Mar 2004, 4:59am

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Bryce007

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HEY!! IM ANGRY!!! I WANT TO FIGHT!!








razz i was joking guys...
Posted: Fri, 12th Mar 2004, 10:08am

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stqagehanduk

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Why? And why with me? I'm kind to animals and small chldren. Well, some small children anyway ...
Posted: Fri, 12th Mar 2004, 9:15pm

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jaycoolyea

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(psst. hey, i think he was being sarcastic.)
Posted: Fri, 30th Apr 2004, 2:50am

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Whitey04

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the movie for this has been canceled but right now I'm working on a script for a horror. Hopefully that we start pre - production next week with jaycoolyea and I.
Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 5:14pm

Post 64 of 75

stqagehanduk

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I'm more of a confront-it-and-deal-with-it sort of guy than a shove-it-under-the-carpet-and-ignore-it kind really, and, whatever else you might think about me and my stupid British opinions, I am at least persistent. Very persistent.

So - I believe the subject under discussion before its obliteration twice in as many days was: If you are so indifferent to and uncaring of the opinion of others, why do you actively seek out their approbation while relentlessly eliminating dissent? I'm merely curious.
Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 8:25pm

Post 65 of 75

Mellifluous

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Stqagehand, I kind of agree with what you're saying, but I don't agree with what you're doing, namely reposting here time & again. It's only going to inflame matters e.g. jaycoolea is going to say "shut up!" again.

Hopefully jaycoolea has some inkling of what you're saying, so let it slide. I think we all make mistakes in forums so best thing is to live & let lie.

Certain immature others have also been incredibly rude in this topic, so I can understand you wanting to get your own back, but please... unsure
Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 8:49pm

Post 66 of 75

jaycoolyea

Force: 703 | Joined: 2nd Dec 2003 | Posts: 138

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staqagehanduk, i have no way of deleting posts. i thought that such a knowledgable person as you would know this. i am not an admin. only admins of a forum can delete posts. all i do is comment, and then watch as it all gets deleted. i have nothing to do with the disapearing posts.
Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 9:19pm

Post 67 of 75

Mellifluous

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Nothing in his post says he thinks that. I'd change the wording of your posts, as that's partly responsible.
Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 10:02pm

Post 68 of 75

malone

Force: 18242 | Joined: 21st Mar 2001 | Posts: 1477

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I have seen various mods having to delete parts of your argument. I'm not sure if you have been contacted privately about it; but I would have hoped you'd both take the hint by now and realise it isn't appropriate for this thread or forum.

If you want to have a friendly argument then thats fine. If you want to act aggressive and hurl abusive language about then please continue your squabble in private. If I see people flaming each other here again I will be forced to take action.
Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 10:31pm

Post 69 of 75

averagejoe

Force: 3592 | Joined: 31st Mar 2001 | Posts: 710

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SuperUser

Thank you Malone. I had already planned on contacting them if they started up again. Fortunately you hit the forums earlier in the FXHOME day. Thanks for making the post.

FXHOME day you ask? Well it would be 24 hours, it never closes tard

To whom it may concern. This is not some individual's php message board. It is a Service provided to the community that CSB-Digital products generated. It is ok to vent opinions here. However there is a limit. We (the mods and admins) edit posts and delete them if they take away from the friendly atmosphere we try to maintain. Discussion is one thing. Out and out bashing each other with no decernable point is another. IF you need to mark your territory, go urinate on another tree. We like pee free trees around here. twisted

Play nice and keep things clean.

Last edited Thu, 13th May 2004, 11:23pm; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Thu, 13th May 2004, 10:31pm

Post 70 of 75

stqagehanduk

Force: 460 | Joined: 3rd Jun 2002 | Posts: 438

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I simply raised a point and then got leapt on from a great height, and while I've questioned certain behaviour I've insulted no-one. But point taken.
Posted: Fri, 14th May 2004, 3:14am

Post 71 of 75

jaycoolyea

Force: 703 | Joined: 2nd Dec 2003 | Posts: 138

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i must say stqagehanduk, you are quite a good bullsh.itter.
Posted: Fri, 14th May 2004, 7:24am

Post 72 of 75

Bryce007

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Hahaha...what a great forum.

Hey, i forgot what is being argued?
Posted: Fri, 14th May 2004, 7:43am

Post 73 of 75

Mellifluous

Force: 5604 | Joined: 6th Oct 2002 | Posts: 3782

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Again, jaycoolea, I'd edit your post again. You're only going to get more responses from Stqagehand if you say things like that = vicious circle.
Posted: Fri, 14th May 2004, 8:33am

Post 74 of 75

stqagehanduk

Force: 460 | Joined: 3rd Jun 2002 | Posts: 438

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No, you were quite right Mellifluous. If Jay and his people want to huckster for votes and vote themsleves fives then they my do so without further comment from me. I've said my peice and I apologise to anyone I may have offended in th process.
Posted: Fri, 14th May 2004, 8:43am

Post 75 of 75

malone

Force: 18242 | Joined: 21st Mar 2001 | Posts: 1477

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