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Download my Light Saber sounds here right now.

Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 12:42am

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Sharp

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Rating: +7

[edit] You can now use this permanant link to download the files - http://fxhome.com/sounds/downloads.html - malone [/edit]

Hi All.

I guess my Light Saber sounds are not going to be placed into the Plug’in section. I uploaded them 8 days ago.

Not to worry…. you can download them here right now. This is not a protected download, so I expect to see non-members snatching these and running. All I ask is that you please add a link to my website (http://www.irishacts.com ) and include my name ( Sharp ) if you upload these files elsewhere to the net.

I’ll leave these files online here for 1 week starting today, so hurry up and start downloading before they are deleted.

http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part01.exe
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part02.rar
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part03.rar
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part04.rar
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part05.rar
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part06.rar
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part07.rar
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part08.rar

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 12:56am

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Aculag

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Hmm.. these don't appear to want to open on my mac.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 12:58am

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Marek

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Rating: -2

Hmm... this seems kinda suspicious... exe sound files? why not just zip up some mp3's or wav's... I doubt I'll be downloading these...

Plus, why would they be put in the plugin section? Sounds are definately not plugins, therefore do not belong there.

Last edited Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:16am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:15am

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Sharp

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Hmm... this seems kinda suspicious... exe sound files?
Huh ?? It’s a common self extracting format called Winrar. Surly you knew that ?. This is pretty basic stuff that everyone knows.


I doubt I'll be downloading these
Well that will be your loss. I’m not trying to trick you into downloading a Virus.



________________________________
Hi Aculag.
Hmm.. these don't appear to want to open on my mac
Yes sorry about that. Winrar compressed formats only work on PC’s. If I had of known that I was going to end up hosting the files myself, I would have used something old like “Zip”.

All I can suggest is wait until someone else uploads them, to their own website, or burn them to a CD-RW and get a PC user sot extract the files for you.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:18am

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Sharp

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4Jex wrote:


about every light saber sound you'll ever need.......
Yeah but my ones are 48Khz Stereo and encoded at 320Kbps Mp3 format.

Guys your are really making me feel like I have wasted my time designing these sounds for you all to download for free. I was only trying to help.

So much for doing a nice thing and earning some respect.

Sharp.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:22am

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Marek

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Sharp wrote:


Huh ?? It’s a common self extracting format called Winrar. Surly you knew that ?. This is pretty basic stuff that everyone knows.
http://www.irishacts.com/support/misc/av/light-saber.part01.exe

Last edited Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:52am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:29am

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Sharp

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Marek wrote:

[quote="Sharp
Huh ?? It’s a common self extracting format called Winrar. Surly you knew that ?. This is pretty basic stuff that everyone knows.
All that proves is that you haven’t got a clue.

Look I will prove who I am.
My real name is James Tubbritt.
I’m one of the programmers who actually worked on the new Korg Triton Extreme.

Click on this link, and take a look at the name of the guy who wrote the demo song for this product. It’s called Leanbh Mo Chroi

http://www.korg.com/gear/product_info.asp?a_prod_no=TRITONEXTREME&category_id=1

Note that it refers to the author ( me ) and my website. The very same site that the Light Saber files are hosted from.

I’m a professional sound designer and musician.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 2:09am

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Marek

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Well, I'm sorry for any misunderstanding I may have had, but I have always been one to steer clear of exe files altogether.
If you could perhaps upload zip file of the sound file, I would be sure to download and use them in the event I do a starwars film.

I am truely sorry for any confusion there was on my part. Hope to see you around FXHome more often.

PS. This has nothing to do with your last post. Seriously. biggrin
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 3:07am

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Pooky

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Wow those are awesome!
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 4:08am

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Aculag

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I too am wondering why one file is an exe, and the others aren't...
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 9:26am

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Joshua Davies

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Did you contact Tarn about your sounds? As far as I know I haven't seen them...
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 10:29am

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Aculag

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Well, of course you haven't SEEN them, schwar. They're sounds. wink
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 10:33am

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fertesz

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Correct me if I'm wrong Sharp, but all the files contain same sounds confused Maybe I'm mistaken, but all those .rar and 1 .exe file have identical content confused Why placing 8 files then?
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 11:29am

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Andreas

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Those sounds are really great Sharp! You have not done anything in waste, its just the FXHome members that are a bunch of wossies! razz but I understand them
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 12:51pm

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anonymous

Hi Andreas

Thank you but I must say that I seriously don’t feel like making any more sounds after the response I’ve just received.

People don’t realise how difficult it is to design sounds, and they certainly have no idea how many hours it took me to do this. I then offer the data for free in an attempt to support this community and it gets thrown back in my face.

I know people probably don’t mean it, but it really makes me feel like a total idiot for wasting my time and for trying to actually help this community.

Anyway… I’m delighted to hear that you liked the sounds. Could you please reassure the others now that the files are what I said they are, and not some sad attempt to send people a Virus.

Regards.
Sharp.


__________________________________
Hi fertesz.

No the files don’t contain the same sounds. It’s a 24MB set spanned out across a few files. You need to place all the files in the same folder on your PC, and then run the exe file.

The reason why one of the files is an exe is simple. That file has all the information needed to extract the mp3 files correctly. It also means that you do not need to install the Winrar program on your PC.

For example…. If I uploaded a Zip file you would need to have Winzip software installed on your PC to open the data. Well with Winrar you don’t, the exe file holds all the data necessary to extract all the files.

Two people so far have already extracted the files, and I have already made it very clear who I am. My name and reputation is a very important part of my business, and I promise you that this is not a trick to fool you into downloading a Virus.

Regards.
Sharp.

_________________________________________
Hi schwar.

No I didn’t send Tarn an email, I sent you a PM.
Don’t worry about it anyway… It’s tool late now.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 12:57pm

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Joshua Davies

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We are still willing to host them if you want?

I've been very busy coding which is why I said you should email tarn as he can give you the time you need on these kinda things.

If you would like to email me directly its joshua.davies@fxhome.com
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 1:12pm

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malone

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hey Sharp,

I've only just spotted this topic. Just downloaded and unrared the files fine, and I have to say, they are fantastic, you have a lot of talent. Im sure everyone else would love to hear them as well, its a pity they were put off by the rar. I'd like it if we could smooth things over and start again.

It'd be great if we could help out with the distribution, I will pm you and see if we can sort out something.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 3:06pm

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TAP2

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The guy has been kind enough to design us very highquality lightsabre effects, and some of you can't even say 'thank you'

Most people who aren't cretins know that not all exe files are viruses, and you can easily scan it with a virus checker.

They're really great sounds, and I greatly appreciate them... can't say the same for others though. Just in the future guys, don't be so aggressive towards someone who's trying to help.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 3:16pm

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Brettsta

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They're amazing smile

I made a zip file of all of the sounds. Sharp, tell me if I can post em. Where can I host a 22 meg zip file?
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 3:48pm

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fertesz

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Hey, maybe I got it wrong, but I exported all the sounds in the SEPARATE folders. A I ended with 8 identical sets of sounds... WhenI tried to export them in the same folder, it asked me if I want to overwrite confused
I like your sounds, even though some of them sound kinda 'strange' for me, but I need some time to try them perhaps, to be sure razz Great work nevertheless, don't get discouraged. Things like that are more then welcome in this community!
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 4:36pm

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Sharp

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fertesz wrote:

Hey, maybe I got it wrong, but I exported all the sounds in the SEPARATE folders. A I ended with 8 identical sets of sounds... WhenI tried to export them in the same folder, it asked me if I want to overwrite confused
Hi.

No, just follow the instructions I posted.

Place all the files in a single folder and only run the exe file.
Don’t even touch the other files.

The exe file will automatically process all the other files all on it’s own.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 4:40pm

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Brettsta

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Yeha, dont export individually. I made a lightsabersounds folder and place the rar files in there, then put the exe in therfe and opened it. It extracts everything.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 4:50pm

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fertesz

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OK, got it now, thanks smile
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 5:35pm

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Marek

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Look, I'm sorry for being concerned for the well being of my new computer which isnt even mine. It's my parents. So I must be extra careful when downloading things. And I've always tried to avoid exe's. It's nothing against anyone. Its one of those poisoning the well type of things.

And plus i don't plan on making a starwars film anytime within the next year, so i probably wont need the sounds then smile

Sorry for my misunderstanding. I'm not too keen on compression formats and things like that so some people might be able to see where I'm coming from. If you ever make any other sounds or songs (if you do songs that is) I'll be sure to download them.

Once again, sorry for the misunderstanding. Don't let it get you down. I would love to see some more of your work show up, as I'm sure many other people would as well.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 5:43pm

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malone

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We are now hosting all the saber sounds (as zips) on FXHome. Check out the sound downloads page under the "More" tab above. Heres a direct link
http://fxhome.com/sounds/downloads.html

Hopefully we will expand this section and add more sound packs in future. If anyone has anything they'd like to submit please contact us at team@fxhome.com (note: we will only except files that are your own work).

The fxhome team would like to thank Sharp for his fantastic work, and we hope the community enjoys these downloads.
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 6:01pm

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Brettsta

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Thats cool malone. I think you should just write something next to the sounds in bold saying you cannot use these directly in the csb products so people dont get confused. SOmething like tfhat if you know what I mean.

Edit: I see youve already written this:
You can use your video editor to add these sounds and enhance your movies
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 10:37pm

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MrShmoe

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Good Sounds!
I've been loooking (ok not really, but I've been thinking about looking) for good lightsabersound in a week now, and finally I got some.

Thanks Sharp!
Posted: Sat, 27th Mar 2004, 11:23pm

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Aculag

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Woopee! Now that they're zips, I downloaded them, and they're wonderful. VERY nice work, sharp.
Posted: Sun, 28th Mar 2004, 5:45am

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anonymous

Yea, guys...I know this is basically over with already, but if you have a good decompression program installed (such as WinZip, WinAce, WinRar, etc.) you could have just right-clicked on the .exe file and selected "Extract to..." or whatever your decompression software says. That way, if you are truly scared of catching a virus...you don't even need to execute the file! Just extracting or decompressing a file will not install a virus on your system. There was really never anything to worry about...some of you are waaaay too paranoid. And Mac users, yes...I know for a fact that there is decompression software for the .rar format, which I believe will also interpret the self-extracting .exe file and run everything just fine.
Posted: Sun, 28th Mar 2004, 7:17am

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Aculag

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I have stuffit expander, which will extract .rar files, but it didn't do anything on those. But anyway, the .zips worked great.
Posted: Sun, 28th Mar 2004, 8:30pm

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hahoozhafax

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Hey Sharp thanks for making and uploading those sounds. I haven't gotten a chance to download them yet but i'm sure they're wonderlful and I'll be downloading them soon. I think its great that you would actually take the time to create those sounds specifally for us fxhome members.
Anyway I was just wondering how your songs are coming along. I know you posted something a while ago about you wanting to make some (perticularly ones with a choir of some sort). I'm sure everyone here would appreciate them and could use them. Thanks Again!!
Keep up the good work!! smile
Posted: Mon, 29th Mar 2004, 12:37am

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wdy

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Its people like Sharp that help make our films that much better. Its great to have someone who is willing to do this fine audio work for free you are definately a king man. Keep it up and hopefully some day we can do something for you in return. Thanks.
Posted: Mon, 29th Mar 2004, 11:44am

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Sharp

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Hi everyone.

Thanks a million, and I’m delighted to see that people are actually getting to download them now. Also thank you for the kind words.

I’ve received a few suggestions from people on other sounds to make like, Bullet Timing like in the Matrix, Computer panel sounds, alarms, and a few others,…. So I will make them for you all pretty soon.

I’ll start with the Bullet Timing effects since that will probably be the most difficult one out of the lot to create.

Anyway… If you have any suggestions, feel free to post them on the forum and I will see what I can come up with.

Kind Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Mon, 29th Mar 2004, 11:48am

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Simon K Jones

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Wow, thanks again Sharp. Great to have someone of your skills helping out the community!

I think all of us know just how important sound is to a decent movie. The problem is that very few of us know much about it, let alone how to create high quality sounds for use in our movies. Although there are loads of books, tutorials etc about cinematography, editing, acting and the like, finding information about sound is somewhat trickier.

I'm sure your efforts will inspire a noticeable increase in the quality of movie soundtracks submitted to the FXhome cinema.
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 2:28am

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Mr Anderson

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yeah... these files are awesome. And there arent any viruses. Norton Anti-virus approved!
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 7:53am

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wpl

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dude, sharp how do you make that kindda stuff? eek
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 9:26am

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TAP2

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making sounds is an art.
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 11:40am

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Sharp

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Rating: +3

Hi WiRyPoCkEtLiNt

I’m glad you like them.
It’s actually very difficult to make sounds like this, but once you get an idea of how they made the original ones, and after listening to them over and over in the movie, it’s possible to recreate them digitally using Synth’s.

I may as well post how it was done because I’m sure someone here will find this rather interesting.

I worked out that the Light Saber was basically built from 3 different types of sounds.

1: From reading the Net we know they sampled an old film projector. So I created the noise an old projector would generate and I filtered that to take away the mechanical sound of it so I was left with pretty much the deadened sound of the Film Clicking. I then pitch shifted it down 1 Octave and it was perfect. This gives that fizzling sound the Light Saber generates.

2: Again from reading the net, we know that the second source they used was a mic placed behind a TV. This caused some interference and it generated an electrical hum back in those days. So… easily enough I tested a few different waveforms on my Synth, passed each one through bunch of filters, and kept changing hundreds of settings until I fine tuned the sound down to an electrical humming noise close to the original.

3: And the last part of the puzzle was actually due to the year the original sounds where made. Apparently back when the original Light Saber sounds where being created, the recording media they had back then was very low quality (probably tape) and it produced a hissing sound. So I simply recreated that hissing sound digitally on a Synth by using some White Noise passed through a bunch of filters.

Now that I have the 3 elements needed to create a Light Saber, I sampled all these sounds individually into an AKAI S5000 Sampler. There I merged them and created as many variations of the mix as I possible could. I even recorded different pitches. Once I was happy with what I was hearing, it was time to pass them over to my other Synth for final Filtering and to add all the effects.

So I loaded all the samples I created into a Korg Triton Studio and started to combine them in a Combi mode. I used a range of tricks here to create all the different types of humming effects and swinging effects.

For example, the pulsating humming effects that last 1 minute long each are simply the straight humming samples modulated.

The different pitch changes in the samples that simulates the swinging effect of the Light Saber is actually nothing more than the good old Doppler effect. Back when the original samples where being made they would swing a mic in front of a speaker and record the Doppler effect that the Mic would have obviously picked up. Thankfully now days we don’t have to do that. We can just pull up a Doppler Effect from an Effects Racks to process the source material. Beats swinging an very expensive condenser Mic around any day.

So between all that I could pretty much replicate any sounds I needed to simulate a Light Saber in use.

Next was to create the Light Saber being turned on and off.
I simply added sweeping modulated filters to a bunch of samples I created earlier. After tweaking a lot of settings, that gave me the sound of a light saber being turned on. To create the light saber being turned off I simply played back in reverse the sound of a light saber being turned on. So if you actually listen to both, while they sound complete different, your actually hearing the exact same sounds. One if them is just played backwards.

That’s pretty much it really. It’s technically simply enough to do, but by heck does it take imagination and ages to get the filter settings right.

I must actually finish off the set someday. I still didn’t make any Clashing effects because they seem to be created from a completely different range of sounds and there’s no info available on the net as to how the originals where made.

Anyway… I hope someone found my little rant interesting.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 11:48am

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Aculag

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If I don't end up directing, I would really love a job doing sound design/foley stuff. That sounds like so much fun. I've experimented on it a bit myself. I made a blood/brains splat by dumping a bucket of slushy water onto concrete. Worked like a charm.

So all of this stuff, you made with a Synth? Where can I find something like that?
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 12:38pm

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Sharp

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Aculag wrote:

If I don't end up directing, I would really love a job doing sound design/foley stuff. That sounds like so much fun. I've experimented on it a bit myself. I made a blood/brains splat by dumping a bucket of slushy water onto concrete. Worked like a charm.

So all of this stuff, you made with a Synth? Where can I find something like that?
Hi.

Yeah, it really can be loads of fun as you have seen. Cool idea btw smile

There have been times I’ve actually fallen around the place laughing at some of the stuff I had to make.

So all of this stuff, you made with a Synth? Where can I find something like that?
The first synth was an Access Virus KB.
http://www.access-music.de


The Sampler is an AKAI S5000.
http://www.akaipro.com


And the synth that I finished everything off on was a Triton Studio.
http://www.korg.com



Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 12:43pm

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Aculag

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That's somewhat more complex than I figured.

Someday, though.... Someday...

cool
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 3:22pm

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adamlightandmagic

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Hey Sharp. I like the sounds. But I have a couple of gripes. They sound a bit overly processed and why have you stereo'd them? Mono is always better for post work.

I'll try using them, But I fear the worst. They're a little too present in the mix.

Peace,
Adam.
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 4:19pm

Post 43 of 53

anonymous

Hi adamlightandmagic.

But I have a couple of gripes. They sound a bit overly processed
In what way ?. They sound pretty clear to me and I’m listening to them on a pair of Mackie 824 monitors.

and why have you stereo'd them?
Simply because Stereo is better for professional quality work.
If you need them in mono then convert them to mono. It won’t take you more than a few seconds.

I'll try using them, But I fear the worst. They're a little too present in the mix
That’s because they are at a perfect 0dB.
With any sounds your supposed to drop the volume on them to make them sit into the mix.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Tue, 30th Mar 2004, 4:28pm

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adamlightandmagic

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I should've mentioned that I'd already dropped the volume and they still sounded a little too present.

I don't get what you mean about stereo being better for professional work. I've always felt that mono recordings of this kind present more mixing options. While pre-stereo'd effects are a little wasteful to the overall mix. Especially when it comes to sound effects. I'd rather you used your source sounds to create mono versions because they'll be better quality than if I simply mono'd them myself.

Adam.
Posted: Wed, 31st Mar 2004, 3:29pm

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Sharp

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Hi.

I don't get what you mean about stereo being better for professional work
There’s only so much your going to be able to do with what you have. If this were a Movie where you could afford to have me sitting beside you, I would obviously be sitting in a Studio with all my gear processing each sound to fit the frames on the screen.

For example…. You might need someone walking towards the camera with a Light Saber in his hand. All you can do right now with what you have is turn up the Volume, where if I where beside you we would be modifying Filters on a Synth to go from a distant sound to a up close sound.

That’s why Sound Effects costs millions in Movies. It’s all done in the Studio. So don’t worry, there’s obviously going to be only so much you can do with what I upload.

Regards.
Sharp.

PS: Regarding having Mono Sounds, it’s nearly always a Stereo signal panned within a 5.1 Surround Sound spectrum.
Posted: Wed, 31st Mar 2004, 3:54pm

Post 46 of 53

adamlightandmagic

Force: 580 | Joined: 3rd Nov 2001 | Posts: 611

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Dude, I'm a sound guy myself - I too have gear and software galore. But if you listen to the saber in my previous film, Corrupt Data, you'll be able to hear that my previous saber sounds were fine. I didn't have to EQ or change anything, just volume and pan movements. This is an amateur community, you know.

Adam.
Posted: Wed, 31st Mar 2004, 4:17pm

Post 47 of 53

anonymous

Hi.

Sure, whatever works for you.
There’s really no point in dragging this out, so fair enough.

Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Wed, 31st Mar 2004, 4:37pm

Post 48 of 53

adamlightandmagic

Force: 580 | Joined: 3rd Nov 2001 | Posts: 611

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I don't mean to drag things out. I'm only confused by the huge amount of mix stage these sounds take up. And that's down to two things:

1. The stereo'd effect (especially the left to right movements) confused
and 2. The overall processed sound.

I take my hat off to you for these BRAND NEW sounds! However with my previous suggestions, they could work in many more situations. Keep the stereo versions. But I'd advise that mono versions are made by yourself, too. Hope you get what I mean. wink

Peace,
Adam.
Posted: Wed, 31st Mar 2004, 8:37pm

Post 49 of 53

Sharp

Force: 2196 | Joined: 30th Dec 2003 | Posts: 354

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Hi Adam.

I know what your referring to but it all depends on the way your software deals with the sounds. For example… If I panned a stereo sample left, it would shift the enter left and right channel of the waveform to the left side of a 5.1 surround spectrum.

So that would mean that the true left channel would be sitting between the rear left and front felt speaker, and the right channel would be coming from the front left speaker.

The idea is that if two people are in a fight sequence on the screen, the sounds that the guy on the felt makes come from both front and rear left speakers, and the guy on the right comes from the front and rear right speakers.

This gives you a pretty good effect that doesn’t totally take over the entire mix of the audio.

The problem with doing it this way is that you only have to work with what I gave you. And that’s why I said that if we where sitting in the Studio I could take control over the sound placements far better than you could ever do with your setup. Simply because I have the Sysex data that the original samples where created from and I can decide exactly what goes where in the mix. You can’t do that with a Stereo file.

So…. Back to what your where saying. Mono samples. Yes they have their place and that’s exactly what I would end up creating if we where placing all this into an actual pro movie. I would have provided you with a mix of both stereo and mono samples so you could control the sound placement in the mix perfectly.

With that said, your only solution at this point is to take some of the stereo samples I made and create a second copy of them in mono.

Maybe someday when I get the time I’ll actually go back and make a fresh batch of mono samples.

So the bottom line is… what I have uploaded is not the entire collection of what you would actually need. You would need a few mono samples. Heck… I still have to make some Light Saber Clashing sounds. I will soon, but not at the moment.

Just one more thing…. Please don’t feel like I’m getting thick with you on this subject either. I would love to help you in anyway I can. The more feedback I get the better. If people speak up, I’ll be able to make what your looking for. Remember that I’m a sound engineer only. I don’t make movies, so it’s you guys that need to tell me what you want at the end of the day.

Kind Regards.
Sharp.
Posted: Fri, 2nd Apr 2004, 1:30pm

Post 50 of 53

spaced65

Force: 1620 | Joined: 9th May 2002 | Posts: 12

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Just want to know if those Saber Clash sounds are in one of the above mentioned files??
Posted: Fri, 2nd Apr 2004, 1:37pm

Post 51 of 53

adamlightandmagic

Force: 580 | Joined: 3rd Nov 2001 | Posts: 611

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Fair enough, Sharp. I'll still use 'em! I'm re-editing my Corrupt Data film and these will come in very handy.

Thanks,
Adam.
Posted: Thu, 8th Apr 2004, 9:53am

Post 52 of 53

donkey

Force: 200 | Joined: 15th Jul 2003 | Posts: 21

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hey thanks alot for sounds they worked perfectly. keep up the good work. i appreciate and im sure alot of people do
good work mate
Posted: Mon, 12th Apr 2004, 1:44am

Post 53 of 53

FiveIronFrenzy

Force: 464 | Joined: 25th Dec 2003 | Posts: 438

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Sorry for any hurt feelings. Just need to be carful these days.