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Frame mode

Posted: Sun, 5th Sep 2004, 10:37pm

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Evman

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Does anyone here use the frame mode option on your cameras? Does it look better than interlaced?
Posted: Sun, 5th Sep 2004, 11:40pm

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Aculag

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Try it and find out.
Posted: Sun, 5th Sep 2004, 11:55pm

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Evman

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yeah, that was a bad question. nevermind.
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 4:31pm

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Animator

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Rating: +1

Since i tryed it, I decided to use it to almost all my films...
It looks fantastic, this is your best option to get it look more professional (if you shoot it right to of course)

It also give you more control and quality when doing freez-frames.

Try It!
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 5:07pm

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effstops

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Rating: +1

IF you want to put any of your footage in slow-motion, however, frame-mode will look choppy. Interlaced looks much better in this regard because the two fields that show up on a single frame are taken every 1/60th of a second (not 1/30th)... it looks SMOOTHER, but not as cinematic.

I shoot my films in frame mode, but if there's a shot I know I'll want to slow down in post, I'll always switch over to interlaced. (Also, multiple takes are a good idea for those shots in case you decide not to use slow-motion. There is a noticable difference.)

--Colin
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 7:11pm

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Evman

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cool, thanks for the comments.
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 7:20pm

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Cutty201

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Do you guys do slowmotion on the camera or in post ?
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 7:32pm

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Aculag

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You have to do it in post. I don't think there are any DV cameras that can shoot in slow motion.
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 8:11pm

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Kyeju

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Yea in-camera slow motion is really the thing that would make me want to upgrade cameras.
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 8:54pm

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NoClue

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Cutty201 wrote:

Do you guys do slowmotion on the camera or in post ?
At the moment you have to do it in post. Unless you can afford one of these :-

http://www.speedcam.com/english-l3cat49.html

biggrin
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 9:32pm

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Aculag

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I want one.
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 10:06pm

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effstops

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I don't think there are any DV cameras that can shoot in slow motion.

The XL-2's and Panasonic DVX-100a (or something like that) can shoot in 60i, which means 60 frames per second, with TWO fields each frame. Which means you could slow down your footage to 25% it's original speed (or stretched 400%) without any frame blending. Cool, huh?

--Colin
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 10:17pm

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Aculag

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60i is just 30fps but with 2 fields. Most cameras can do that same thing.

And that's still post work. You can't actually SHOOT in slow motion.
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 10:40pm

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cantaclaro

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Aculag is correct. The HD cameras that we used this summer had the same 2 settings (60i and 24p) and after talking to the camera man he told me that all DV cameras shoot 60i but it is referred to as 30fps.

Canta unsure

Last edited Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 10:45pm; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 10:43pm

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Evman

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ah, canta, that sig is now finally beginning to creep me out. like its in my future...
Posted: Mon, 6th Sep 2004, 11:38pm

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Cutty201

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ya... 60i is what EVERY SINGLE USA Camera shoots at ... 60Interlaced Frames ... the XL2 has 60i(nterlaced), 30p(rogressive), 24p(rogressive). In order for the XL2 or any other camera to have built in slowmotion (realistically) is for it to be able to shoot at 50FPS or higher smile. (LIKE MY FILM CAMERA !!! BIZNITCHES!!!!...that's really what i was itchin at)

BUT ANYWHO ya the reason I bring it up is because I once again wanna plug Motion Perfect because I learned a lil more about it. See when you guys do Slow Mo now in post..what it's doin is repeating frames. So you're seeing the same frames more. MotionPerfect (from DynaPel) changes framerates for you, however what it does is judges what frames need to be repeated and instead of repeating them, creates a new frame based on the two in needs to add in between and frame by frame analyze what it needs..okay that doesnt seem like made much sense...time for pictures smile



ANYWHO, I have the program so ... im gonna go and try some of that and see how well it works smile
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 2:00am

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effstops

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Wait wait wait... what? 60i is just 30 fps? Then how come I've only seen that terminology on the XL-2 and high-end Panasonics' spec sheets? Like, why not for GL-2?

Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about... biggrin
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 2:03am

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ben3308

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Maybe you don't. smile
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 2:11am

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effstops

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Maybe you're right. razz
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 2:20am

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ben3308

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Maybe I am. smile




.......Wait, what did I just say?
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 2:51pm

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NoClue

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effstops wrote:

Wait wait wait... what? 60i is just 30 fps? Then how come I've only seen that terminology on the XL-2 and high-end Panasonics' spec sheets? Like, why not for GL-2?

Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about... biggrin
This is the way I understand it (everyone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong). 60i is the equivilant of 30fps in NTSC, not the SAME as.
As I understand it, NTSC is not interlaced, like PAL, which is why nobody else uses it if they can avoid it (hehe biggrin ). That's one of the reasons you sometimes get fuzzy lines at the top and bottom of your footage when you convert from NTSC to PAL.

The reason you don't see 60i in the specs for the GL-2 (which is american and only films in NTSC) is that you can't switch BETWEEN the two. The XL2 can.

Does this make sense?
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 9:16pm

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Gibs

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No no no. NTSC is indeed interlaced. And 30fps NTSC is the same thing as 60i. The GL2 can shoot 60i and 30p, which is 30fps not interlaced.
Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 9:29pm

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Joshua Davies

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Right, just to confirm..

NTSC standard is 30fps and 60 interlaced fields per second.

It used to just be called 30fps as there were no progressive cameras on the market. Since the introduction of the XM1 (and more importantly HD standards) standard NTSC is now known as 60i. 60i is the standard for any NTSC tv set (just as 50i is the standard for PAL tvs) and is 60 fields per second (NTSC - 2 fields per frame so 30fps, PAL - 2 fields per frame at 25fps).

The new progressive standards are known as 30p, 25p or 24p (depending on the frame rate). Cameras such as the GL1, GL2, XL1S can all record 60i and 30p (although the progressive on these cameras is faked and not as good as real progressive - hence they call it frame mode). The new XL2 can not only do 60i but also 30p (but real progressive and great quality) and 24p.

The other part of the new names is the vertical resolution - rather than NTSC of PAL we now have the following :-

NTSC
480/60i - standard NTSC DV 720x480 at 30 frames per second with 2 interlaced fields per frame
480/30p - standard NTSC DV but 30 frames per second progressive
480/24p - NTSC but 25 frames progressive

PAL
576/50i - PAL 720x576 DV 25 frames per second with 2 interlaced fields a frame
576/25p - PAL 25 frames progressive

This fits standard definition cameras in to the HD naming system (1080/60i etc). Not all companys use these names yet but they are being used more and more as progressive spreads to cheaper cameras.

Last edited Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 9:38pm; edited 3 times in total.

Posted: Wed, 8th Sep 2004, 9:30pm

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NoClue

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Ahh. Well that shows you what I know living in the UK.