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Terri Schiavo Dies

Posted: Thu, 31st Mar 2005, 11:19pm

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cinemafreak

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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7293186/?GT1=6305

Well, the political exploitation, public drama, and other aspects of this case that were blown completely out of purportion have finally come to an end. I believe that Micheal Schiavo did the right thing. Who would want to live in an unconcieouss state, as a puppet, for all of their lives. Your thoughts on the case...
Posted: Thu, 31st Mar 2005, 11:28pm

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DigiSm89

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It was claimed that Terry wanted to live. People were wondering whether they perhaps misinterpreted her groans when the matters were discussed around her.

DigiSm89
Posted: Thu, 31st Mar 2005, 11:29pm

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Coureur de Bois

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Im sure glad it's not the only thing on the news anymore. I'm just really sick of hearing about the whole situation.
Posted: Thu, 31st Mar 2005, 11:32pm

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DigiSm89

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orion0340 wrote:

Im sure glad it's not the only thing on the news anymore. I'm just really sick of hearing about the whole situation.
Ditto. I'm a bit mffed that this sort of thing became so much of a big deal.
Posted: Thu, 31st Mar 2005, 11:37pm

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Rawree

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I havn't really seen much of this story so it doesn't have that much of an impact on me. I am however of the belief that it shouldn't really be that big a deal and everyone should have let them make their own decisions. It really irritates me when the courts get involved in more "personal" issues like this.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 12:02am

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Evman

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she was basically a vegetable for 15 years... I know I wouldn't want to be kept alive like that that long... This was way overblown, and I don't think its anyone's decision to keep her alive or not other than her and her family.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 12:02am

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Mellifluous

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Mmmm, well the courts only got involved because there was conflict between her husband & her parents over what should happen. The case did get a bit ridiculous when Bush intervened, only to have his wishes be disregarded by the judges...

I think the issues within the case are important though, & shouldn't be swept aside just because some kiddies are bored of seeing it on the news. Issues such as euthenasia & right to death/life, & our perceptions of what makes a human life valuable/human were all contained in this case, & they're all issues that could potentially affect everyone.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 12:20am

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Rawree

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Mellifluous wrote:


I think the issues within the case are important though, & shouldn't be swept aside just because some kiddies are bored of seeing it on the news. Issues such as euthenasia & right to death/life, & our perceptions of what makes a human life valuable/human were all contained in this case, & they're all issues that could potentially affect everyone.
I've always felt that euthenasia is an important subject and by no means think it should be swept aside. For me though there is no real debate to be had as it seems to me (perhaps in a rather simplistic way) that the decision should be made by the individual, or failing that the person closest to the individual (This is perhaps where the conflict would come in) and if the person is literally in a state of being a "vegetable" then the decision should be made in favour of the party who want to end the individual's life.

I realise that in a real scenario it's much more complex than that but there really should be no long drawn out debate in the courts - it should be a simple decision based on the individual's condition.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 12:54am

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LilCaesars

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I think they should have let her live. The only reason her husband wanted her dead was for the money. That's why he wouldn't divorce her. She had over a million dollars that she won in a court case and he would get it all if she died but none if he divorced her. If the parents wanted her alive that bad he should have let them pay for her care. This really got out of hand. We always try and find loopholes in what we can and can't do. This is basically murder, but since she is unable to feed herself and all we did was take away the food it isn't considered that. It'll be interesting to see how this plays out in the future with other families. I think this opened a new door that will become an equal argument to present day abortion.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:27am

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Aculag

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AcjPictures wrote:

stuff
Give me a break. Had it not been for the meddling of man and medicine, Terry Schiavo would have been dead 15 years ago, and the public of the world would not have been force-fed the meaningless drama that surrounded her "life" for oh so long.

There was no reason to try and keep this woman alive. Not for as long as they did. Her brain was basically dead, and all she was capable of doing was... oh wait... nothing. If you can't swallow without a machine's help, you don't belong in the realm of the living. It's basic science of nature. Survival of the fittest type stuff.

Before this whole ordeal, I was fine with the idea of science helping people to survive, but when you're clinging on to something that's long gone and has no chance of return, it just becomes an utter waste of money, and time. Not only for the family, as they should just let her go and continue on with their lives, but also for the staff of the hospitals, doctors, etc.

I could go on and on and on. It's over now, she's dead, she's where she was supposed to be 15 years ago, and I'm glad.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:30am

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Hybrid-Halo

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Aculag wrote:

AcjPictures wrote:

stuff
The plain truth
Amen.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:40am

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Frozenpede

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well some of you know that Im a radical conservative so Ill try to keep my opinions as downplayed as possible on this (if everyone did the same itd be nice wink ) but personally I have to wonder at the value of life. I mean you only get it once....is it possible that even though right now we look at being a handicap and wonder how people do it.... is it possible that one can actually be satisfied with life as a handicap? is there something that we dont catch until we actually ARE in that position ourselves. I guess the question is....when does life become worthless... and then, do the people that we perceive to be in the position where it is actually think their life is worthless?

Along side that....to have one mans word (I dont care WHO he is) dictate anothers life.... thats creepy.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:46am

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voiceoverwizard

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Aculag wrote:

AcjPictures wrote:

stuff
...If you can't swallow without a machine's help, you don't belong in the realm of the living...
Well I guess you have spoken. I guess then we should have(to use films as a source) let Christopher Reeves die in 1995 and why did they not just let Kirk Douglas die since he had to put on life support before he died... OH WAIT ...
I mean before he recovered!

But since you have spoken now we all know no need to go to court just die and shut up about it since we "Don't belong in the realm of the living"
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:46am

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Evman

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Frozenpede wrote:

well some of you know that Im a radical conservative so Ill try to keep my opinions as downplayed as possible on this (if everyone did the same itd be nice wink ) but personally I have to wonder at the value of life. I mean you only get it once....is it possible that even though right now we look at being a handicap and wonder how people do it.... is it possible that one can actually be satisfied with life as a handicap? is there something that we dont catch until we actually ARE in that position ourselves. I guess the question is....when does life become worthless... and then, do the people that we perceive to be in the position where it is actually think their life is worthless?

Along side that....to have one mans word (I dont care WHO he is) dictate anothers life.... thats creepy.
Aculag said it perfectly. She should have been dead 15 years ago. She was not going to get better. If I were her, i'd be glad I was dead right now... except I wouldn't be glad about anything cause im dead and can't express emotion or feelings... razz

justinsane wrote:

Aculag wrote:

AcjPictures wrote:

stuff
...If you can't swallow without a machine's help, you don't belong in the realm of the living...
Well I guess you have spoken. I guess then we should have(to use films as a source) let Christopher Reeves die in 1995 and why did they not just let Kirk Douglas die since he had to put on life support before he died... OH WAIT ...
I mean before he recovered!

But since you have spoken now we all know no need to go to court just die and shut up about it since we "Don't belong in the realm of the living"
Um... last time I checked, Christopher Reeve was concious and willing to try to get better... Terry Schiavo wasn't.

Last edited Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:48am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 1:46am

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Madmanmatty

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Whatever the case, a person is dead.
Who are we to comment on the morality of the issue?
Was it right? Was it wrong?
I don't know the facts, I don't know the intentions. All I know is that someone is dead.
We should respect her memory and leave it at that.
I don't want to go as a "political fiasco" I want to go as a human being.
That's what she was, and that's the way we should remember her.
Not as the "political flavor of the week".

-Logan-
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 2:38am

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Frozenpede

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justinsane I know it is easy to get mad over this (beleive me Im burning up inside) but its not helping our case. The best I can do I guess is try to explain why. SO heres the deal:

its true a person is dead, and we should remmember her for that...but it goes beyond just a death. It goes into the future deaths of thousands like her. You know there was a period in which she was not on the tube (96 and 97) only her husband ordered ber back on it. She was not in a coma this whole time either...she was concious. That brings into quesion all kinds of things. Then there is the fact that one man decided what her quality of life was. Does anyone remmember Scott Peterson? he decided the quality of his wife too. You cant trust someone just because they have wedding ring. Along with that..... evman101 what have you acheived lately? I mean REALLY acheived? I think we should starve you to death. Its what you would want....trust me. Of course we arnt going to give you a say in it....dosnt that bother you? I dont know...its sets precidents.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 2:54am

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Hybrid-Halo

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My bet is america is nuking Iraq right now, it's the only reason I can think of as to why the demise of a severely ill person has become such a media storm.

It's really difficult to comment on this matter without offending someone, as it is obviously a touchy moral subject but I have already stated I agree with what Aculag said so I'll stick to that.

50 years ago, she would have died like many other people with similiar conditions. And when life gets a level where it isn't really existing in any sense of the word. Life never loses value, though you have to ask whether or not in her case... it's life anymore.

This whole subject has got way too much attention, quite frankly... it's embarassing.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 2:57am

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Evman

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Frozenpede wrote:

justinsane I know it is easy to get mad over this (beleive me Im burning up inside) but its not helping our case. The best I can do I guess is try to explain why. SO heres the deal:

its true a person is dead, and we should remmember her for that...but it goes beyond just a death. It goes into the future deaths of thousands like her. You know there was a period in which she was not on the tube (96 and 97) only her husband ordered ber back on it. She was not in a coma this whole time either...she was concious. That brings into quesion all kinds of things. Then there is the fact that one man decided what her quality of life was. Does anyone remmember Scott Peterson? he decided the quality of his wife too. You cant trust someone just because they have wedding ring. Along with that..... evman101 what have you acheived lately? I mean REALLY acheived? I think we should starve you to death. Its what you would want....trust me. Of course we arnt going to give you a say in it....dosnt that bother you? I dont know...its sets precidents.
You're missing the point...What have I achieved? This morning I got up and went to school. I can say... "Yo, give me some food. I haven't been a vegetable for 15 years... I can get up and move around... I can decide for myself. Terri Schiavo couldn't... and after 15 years, I doubt she ever would be able to...

P.S. - Stop threatening to kill me. razz

Last edited Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 2:58am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 2:57am

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Mr Pencil

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Frozenpede wrote:

(beleive me Im burning up inside)

evman101 what have you acheived lately? I mean REALLY acheived? I think we should starve you to death. Its what you would want....trust me. Of course we arnt going to give you a say in it....dosnt that bother you? I dont know...its sets precidents.

evman101 wrote:

P.S. - Stop threatening to kill me.
/me smells a locked thread.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:09am

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cinemafreak

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The way I see it, Terri was already dead. She was a vegetable, and in a state of limbo. Her parents were the only thing keeping her from the pearly gates. The reason that the Schindler's kept her alive so long was because they had hope for her recovering, even though there was no evidence or indication of improvement or even the ability to improve over fifteen years. Personally, I would want to die. I would want to get on with my life or non-life where ever it leads after death.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:17am

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Bryce007

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I Find it remarkable that people are Ok leaving this life without knowing without a doubt whats on the other side....
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:18am

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LilCaesars

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It amazes me how flipant some of you are with such a big thing as life. You really do only get it once. Whether you believe in the afterlife or not is not relevant right now. Her parents wanted her alive so badly she was still helping them in this life. I thing that is a huge reason to live. Though some may say that she was miserable being "trapped" for 15 years her doctors and nurses reported that she was happy she would even smile and make somewhat of a laugh. I doubt she was unhappy. On one end you say good ridence she was a vegetable let her die then on the other end you care about her needs. How do those two things agree with each other? The husband didn't care for her well being he went of and had more kids. When you are married you take the vows to love and protect through sickness and in health. He broke those vows and then he tried to strip the family of someone they held so dear and he barely cared about anymore. I don't see how you can watch someone die in one of the most agonizing ways and think job well done. This is the same thing that is happening in Holland where 2 year olds can be brought in a killed if they are mentally retarded. This is a slippery slope and I thing big change is going to happen. Aculag why did you quote we saying stuff? That doesn't really make sense to me please explain.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:19am

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Hybrid-Halo

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Bryce007 wrote:

I Find it remarkable that people are Ok leaving this life without knowing without a doubt whats on the other side....
I don't think anyone ever said anything was on the other side, or if there was any form of other side at all. Personally death scares the bejesus outta me, though not enough to make me go to church.

AcjPictures wrote:

Amazing assumptions.
Speaks for itself really. Maybe this isn't a topic that is best discussed in our largely young community. You, I and I imagine countless others are just outsiders looking in on a families tragedy of which we only know the media spin, we're not in a great position to mouth off about their lives.

Frankly, if I was put into that state, I would want my partner to seek happiness elsewhere. Love isn't about a vow, it's about understanding. In this case, I see both the man and wife as being trapped for 15 years and it being something neither of them want.

People are too crazy about the morality of this situation when really, it's none of our business. People are dying of starvation without painkillers or a nurse to aid them. People that aren't costing a fortune just to keep in a vegetable state. Howabout we give them some attention huh?

Last edited Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:25am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:23am

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Evman

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AcjPictures wrote:

I don't see how you can watch someone die in one of the most agonizing ways and think job well done.
She wasn't dying in the most agonizing conditons... she was being kept alive in the most agonizing conditions... for 15 years. The very thing you're trying to to use to lay guilt on some is the same thing that you are advocating...
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:25am

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LilCaesars

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So dieing of dehydration is a pretty good why to die? Those around her have said she was happy there. The only doctor who said anything against it was with her for 45 minutes. Doesn't it seem fishy that her husband brings up oh she wanted to die 7 years after the incident?
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:32am

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Evman

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AcjPictures wrote:

So dieing of dehydration is a pretty good why to die?
No, its a terrible way to die... but she's been through 15 years of just sitting there... essentially a vegetable. You said she should have been kept alive... so what? She could die of dehydration later? They didn't pump her with an OD of morphine because of the ongoing court cases to keep her alive...
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:48am

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voiceoverwizard

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Well My comment was not at all about Terry Shiavo notice I did not mention her name but rather that ACULAG had decided for the other 6 billion people in the world when they "did not belong in the realm of the living" and I just wanted to point out that he nor any court nor any one else has the right to EVER draw that line let alone decide WHERE to draw it. Many people have recovered from many types of illnesses and injuries that required much more "medical intervention" to get them to the point of recovery. That is if you call food and water medical intervention, which I do not.

Point is ACULAG has the power and the right to make that decision for one person himself. If that is the way he feels then so be it but the rest of us can make our own decisions thanks.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 3:53am

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LilCaesars

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I think this whole thing could have been solved very easily. Terri's husband should have divorced her and let the parents take care of her. He obviously doesn't love her since he went of had kids with another woman and is living with her. The parents and family love her a lot and have a huge attachment to her. There is no evidence she is unhappy besides her husbands word. He also brought this up after seven years of care for her. The doctors and nurses with her say she was happy and her family said she would smile when she saw them. I just think this could have been solved very simply and got out of hand.

orion0340 wrote:

Im sure glad it's not the only thing on the news anymore. I'm just really sick of hearing about the whole situation.
This really makes me mad. You are so heartless you want someone to die so you can see a new headline on the news. I can see a little more with those who believe it was pointless because she was a vegetable, but you got bored of hearing it. Honestly do you care for anyone in your life? We spend all of our time trying to advance ourselves in life and gain ground, but we will easily through someone elses life away because it doesn't affect us right. I just think you should have a little more consideration for the people it involves and less for yourself and what bores you and pleases you.

justinsane wrote:

That is if you call food and water medical intervention, which I do not.
One of my teachers is handicapped and is paralyzed fromt he waist down. Every morning his neighbor comes over and helps him get out of bed. Now if there was not his neighbors intervention my teacher couldn't get to the fridge and get food he couldn't get to a phone or do anything and he would die just like terri. So if I said to you why don't we kill my teacher he can't help himself without intervention you would strongly disagree with me. So how is this any different terri schiavo needed nothing but food and water from others well it's the same with my teacher.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 4:33am

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jfbiscardi

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Aculag wrote:

AcjPictures wrote:

stuff
If you can't swallow without a machine's help, you don't belong in the realm of the living. It's basic science of nature. Survival of the fittest type stuff.
I hope you dont smoke or chew tobacco and need to have your jaw removed due to cancer...

She was in a hospice. A place where terminal people go to die. She was NOT going to die until she was put into the hospice and the feeding tube was removed. She was murdered. BEWARE THE RADICAL JUDGES.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 5:01am

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Hybrid-Halo

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Beware the pro-life pansies.

The human race is born to live > further the species > die. Terri was not doing anything remotely close to furthering the species so in terms of being a human being (at it's most animalistic level) she didn't really exist.

Life is indeed a sacred thing, though as to whether Terri actually had a life is a different matter altogether. I don't understand why people are going crazy over this issue. America and england both have soldiers over in Iraq killing people, people are dying of disease in Somalia and starving to death in pain in numerous other third world countries. I don't see how the death of one vegetable really compares to the death of thousands of otherwise totally capable human beings.

Assuming the moral high ground of any life is sacred whilst appearing totally blind to death the world over is a pretty whimsical approach to being a human being if you ask me, though everyone has their right to an opinion. The media is a load of trash and I think it terrible that this whole sorry situation every made the newspapers.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 6:15am

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Madmanmatty

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Halo- please go out and read the book "Johnny Got His Gun".
It's about a WW1 soldier who looses his arms, legs, face, everything.
He is a stump with a mind. He can't move, he can't talk, he can't hear, he can't do anything but think.
I read it and it totally put a new perspective on life for me.
No one know what happens in the mind of a "vegtable". Terri could have been thinking, as Johnny was, wanting to break through to the world.
What if tomorrow they developed a new technology that could see into the minds of people like that and communicate?
It's a shame, a damn shame that it had to end that way. Who cares if 25 years ago she wouldn't have made it this far? She made it.
We invented technology for THIS reason- to help lives.
It was helping her life, however little it seems to you.
In Johnny got his gun, all he ever wants is to see the sunset again, feel the air on his skin, experience the world. He comes to appreciate life in a new way. With the small patch of skin on his forhead left, he eventually feels the touch of a nurse who strokes his lifeless head. It gives him hope.

Maybe Terri wasn't "Furthering the species", but how can you say that she "didn't exist"?? I'm sorry if I'm being a "pro-life pansy", but even if you were dying I'd feel some grief. Yes, people die every day. That's true. It's a part of life. Maybe you could donate to some charities like Amnesty international ( http://www.amnesty.org/ ) and be a small part of the solution in stopping UNNECESSARY death.
This death was unnecessary in my eyes. She could have lived, and she might have felt. Now she can't.
I don't know if it was right or wrong, but I would have done differently.

Seriously. Read Johnny Got His Gun. You may find your view will change.

-Logan-
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 6:16am

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no_hole

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i hope everybody dies, after 15 fuckin years of being machine fed i think its clear that she's not getting better, if i was in a vegetable state(like that person) i would get out of a vegetable state and tell the doctors to kill me and then go back to a vegetable state, cuz life isn't really that great when u look at it it really sucks, i mean if u really look at it u realize that there isnt really a point at all and u get in a state of depression haha like i am but thats beside the point. And for the people who said that u only live once, and who are u to say u kno that r u god? cuz if ur not then u have no fuckin idea, u may re-incarnate or u may jus disappear, u don't kno until u die, so unless u've died then shut the fuck up
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 6:21am

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Madmanmatty

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Dude- listen.
I used to be depressed all the time. It gets better. All I did was educate myself, and learn to take things less seriously.
My philosophy is that life is a big joke: it's heaven if you have a sense of humor, and hell if you don't.
Through all the copious amounts of fecal matter in life, you'll eventually see the cosmic sense of humor underneath it all.
The bad stuff is there to make the good stuff good.
Good cannot exist without bad. Everything has an opposite.
No one knows what happens after death- you won't know until you die. But you basically have a 50/50 chance.
See how everything has an equal?
Live your life positive and do as much good as you can, and either way, when the time comes, you will have lost nothing.

-Logan-
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 6:34am

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no_hole

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yeah i didn't mean to be rude but i hate it when people think that they know whats after death, an yeah i know i'll eventually get better but after a year hope becomes hard haha
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 6:45am

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Madmanmatty

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Keep on truckin.
No one knows what happens after death, but imagination gives us hope.
Religion kind of kills it a bit, by imposing rules and limitations, but they're all just trying to spread that imagination.
The point is- since we DONT know, all we can do is the best we can in the meantime.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 9:26am

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no_hole

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yeah your right
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 10:00am

Post 37 of 76

BackOfTheHearse

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AcjPictures wrote:

I think this whole thing could have been solved very easily.
Wrong. No matter your stance, it still would never have been solved simply no matter what decision were or could have been made.

Terri's husband should have divorced her and let the parents take care of her. He obviously doesn't love her since he went of had kids with another woman and is living with her. The parents and family love her a lot and have a huge attachment to her.
Oh come on. I find it amazing that you can pass judgement for the amount of love this man could or couldn't have. Number one, if I was in that state, I'd think that one of the most loving things a my partner could do for me would be to let me go. Also, deciding what love exactly is happens to be very difficult. Does every couple that gets divorced stop loving each other in some fashion? No. What about people who remarry if their spouse dies? My friend's father died, and several years his mother got married to another man. Does that mean that she didn't love her first husband? Not in the least. Shiavo was essentially gone, she was NOT going to come back. The brain cannot regenerate, and she would have either remained as she was forever, or more probably gotten worse off. Her body would have most likely started to shut itself down slowly, which would have made the situation even worse than it already was.


One of my teachers is handicapped and is paralyzed fromt he waist down. Every morning his neighbor comes over and helps him get out of bed. Now if there was not his neighbors intervention my teacher couldn't get to the fridge and get food he couldn't get to a phone or do anything and he would die just like terri. So if I said to you why don't we kill my teacher he can't help himself without intervention you would strongly disagree with me. So how is this any different terri schiavo needed nothing but food and water from others well it's the same with my teacher.
In the state Terri Shiavo was in, she was in no way, shape, or form able to perform such a function as being a teacher. Your teacher's handicap is completely different.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 4:30pm

Post 38 of 76

Frozenpede

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AcjPictures wrote:

It amazes me how flipant some of you are with such a big thing as life. You really do only get it once. Whether you believe in the afterlife or not is not relevant right now. Her parents wanted her alive so badly she was still helping them in this life. I thing that is a huge reason to live. Though some may say that she was miserable being "trapped" for 15 years her doctors and nurses reported that she was happy she would even smile and make somewhat of a laugh. I doubt she was unhappy. On one end you say good ridence she was a vegetable let her die then on the other end you care about her needs. How do those two things agree with each other? The husband didn't care for her well being he went of and had more kids. When you are married you take the vows to love and protect through sickness and in health. He broke those vows and then he tried to strip the family of someone they held so dear and he barely cared about anymore. I don't see how you can watch someone die in one of the most agonizing ways and think job well done. This is the same thing that is happening in Holland where 2 year olds can be brought in a killed if they are mentally retarded. This is a slippery slope and I thing big change is going to happen. Aculag why did you quote we saying stuff? That doesn't really make sense to me please explain.
Acj, my respect for you has just quadrupled. If I could give you positive ratings for this post I most definatly would.

How many people have heard about the vote in Amsterdam yesterday? they were deciding on whether or not doctors should declare babies as needing to die. Life use to have a value all on its own, not because of what it acheived but simply because it WAS. In our new and busy world centered around objects and the competitiveness of the work place, that seams to be long gone. I guess we call it civilization.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 4:38pm

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Frozenpede

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right after posting that a thought entered my mind. America has always been known as the land of Davy Crockett and Daniel Boone, Lewis and Clark....untamed land. Europe is known for kings and queens, large cities, victorian eras and what not...... me wonders. Ive noticed that these right to die thing comes from the civilized world (Netherlands is where the big drive was started)....I guess it just furthers what I said about civilization.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 4:52pm

Post 40 of 76

LilCaesars

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

The human race is born to live > further the species > die.
If all we are doing is trying to further the human race wouldn't we kill everyone who has done something wrong? By commiting a crime small or big you would be bringing down the society. So if we are only trying to further the human race we would get rid of the homeless and bomb the third world countries.

Hybrid-Halo wrote:

People are too crazy about the morality of this situation when really, it's none of our business. People are dying of starvation without painkillers or a nurse to aid them. People that aren't costing a fortune just to keep in a vegetable state. Howabout we give them some attention huh?
Giving them attention would be doing something other than furthering the human race correct? We would be helping out those doomed anyway. My point is life is about more than furthering the human race. I know I am about to get stormed for saying this but I am a major conservative, a christian, I am pro-life, and I believe in the importance of a human life. That's why we feed the hungry and try and help the third world countries and at least I tried to save Terri Schiavo in the best way I could. This topic isn't going anywhere so this is probably my last post.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 5:26pm

Post 41 of 76

BackOfTheHearse

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AcjPictures wrote:

Hybrid-Halo wrote:

The human race is born to live > further the species > die.
If all we are doing is trying to further the human race wouldn't we kill everyone who has done something wrong? By commiting a crime small or big you would be bringing down the society. So if we are only trying to further the human race we would get rid of the homeless and bomb the third world countries.
You're making wide generalizations here. It's like when the gay marriage debate begins, someone always brings up, "People are going to want to marry their pets next". That is an illogical and non-sequitor arguement, as the situations are different than how you present them. The homeless as well as third-world nations still have the ability to reproduce, biologically and emotionally speaking. Furthermore, by "furthering the species", it has nothing to do with society, and more to do with biology. We are a species, we exist to be born, live, eat, reproduce, and ultimately die. Thus, "getting rid of the homeless" and decimating third-world countries is that exact opposite, as they still have potential for furthering the species. Do not equate society with the definition of life.

AcjPictures wrote:

Hybrid-Halo wrote:

People are too crazy about the morality of this situation when really, it's none of our business. People are dying of starvation without painkillers or a nurse to aid them. People that aren't costing a fortune just to keep in a vegetable state. Howabout we give them some attention huh?
Giving them attention would be doing something other than furthering the human race correct? We would be helping out those doomed anyway.
Again, you are trying to equate two different things and failing. We have the potential and ability to help those in impoverished situations. However, Terri Shiavo, a woman who was not going to ever be able to be off a feeding tube, or reproduce, or have some semblence of life was receiving thousands upon thousands of dollars worth of help that was ultimately useless. Technically, you said it best, though you weren't talking about Terri: "We would be helping out those doomed anyway". In other word, the American people have been giving more time, money, and attention to one woman in a hospice than to the millions of impoverished, tortured, aware elsewhere in the world. I find it highly hypocritical that people would call themselves pro-life in that fashion. You'll protect a terminally ill person, but won't blink twice at the Iraqi civilians killed, who at last count equal between 17,300 and 19,679 deaths since the war began.

AcjPictures wrote:

My point is life is about more than furthering the human race. I know I am about to get stormed for saying this but I am a major conservative, a christian, I am pro-life, and I believe in the importance of a human life. That's why we feed the hungry and try and help the third world countries and at least I tried to save Terri Schiavo in the best way I could. This topic isn't going anywhere so this is probably my last post.
And you make a very presumptuous statement, in an "I'm better than you" fashion. We essentially all believe in the importance of human life here. However, what Terri Shiavo had shouldn't be called life.

I think Eric Schwartz said it well in a song of his:

So you'll execute a person
And protect a single cell
But mercy-kill the terminally ill
And you're goin' straight to hell
I don't know much about
The word of God
Far be it from me
But I can tell you what it ain't
Hypochristianity
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 5:50pm

Post 42 of 76

LilCaesars

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I didn't mean the statement of "I tried to save her in the best way I could." I just wanted to show that sometimes instead of argueing on an internet forum (which I have done) it is better to go out and take some action. I made a little movie with quotes from articles and from direct interviews and sent it off to some people in high places. Now it didn't make a difference but I think it was a better use of my time to try and do that than argueing my point. So finally my last post because I'm not changing any veiws, but I didn't mean that to say I am better than you. Sorry if it came across that way I may disagree with your points, but I don't think I am better than you.
-AcjPictures
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 7:26pm

Post 43 of 76

cinemafreak

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AcjPictures, I am also a christian as are many on this board, but I believe the right thing was done in the situation. Human life is of great importance, but Terri Schiavo is a different story. There is a difference between being kept alive and having a life. Terri Schiavo was essentially brain dead. She wasn't thinking, she couldn't move, she couldn't eat or talk, and her concieoussness was skewed or lost for that matter. There was no evidence that she could recover, it is almost scientifically proven that she couldn't recover (you can't really PROVE anything scientifically). Would YOU want to be kept in a living hell for 50 years?
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 7:37pm

Post 44 of 76

Hybrid-Halo

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Madmanmatty wrote:

Halo- please go out and read the book "Johnny Got His Gun".
It wouldn't change my opinion. Infact I'm to an extent, offended that you don't think I've already thought about the alternatives, the ifs and what ifs. My opinion is unchanging.

I think it's nearing that time when the feeding tubes were removed from this thread. Though nice post nitroviper, you beat me to it. smile

Oh, just on a religious note. I'm not a christian, but I consider myself a moral and fair human being. I too pick up on this holier than thou residue about some people posting. Everyone here agrees that life is precious, it's a given. Just some of us have weighed the situation differently.

We've got it easy compared to Logan.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 9:58pm

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Evman

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What bugs me is that we won't let this go. I heard on the news this morning that 3 people died in philadelphia since last night... thats 3 murders in one night... in the same city. That was a 5 second blurb on the news, while Terri Schiavo filled out the rest. Now think of all the soldiers in iraq who are losing their lives. The death of a person whos been a "vegetable" for 15 years is getting more attention than those brave young men and women, whoe stood a fighting chance.

EDIT

orion0340 wrote:
Im sure glad it's not the only thing on the news anymore. I'm just really sick of hearing about the whole situation.
This really makes me mad. You are so heartless you want someone to die so you can see a new headline on the news. I can see a little more with those who believe it was pointless because she was a vegetable, but you got bored of hearing it. Honestly do you care for anyone in your life? We spend all of our time trying to advance ourselves in life and gain ground, but we will easily through someone elses life away because it doesn't affect us right. I just think you should have a little more consideration for the people it involves and less for yourself and what bores you and pleases you.
UGH... wow... so we're supposed to spend the rest of our lives feeling sad for her? She died... OH WELL people die every day and no one cares. The only reason why this is special is because it was overblown by the media. You're making this some special case, but you don't know 99.9999% of the people who die every day. Suck it up.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 10:28pm

Post 46 of 76

Madmanmatty

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Fair enough.
If you choose to think of it as a gracious death, that's fine. Everyone gets thier own perspective. I'm not trying to be "holier than thou", I'm simply trying to fuel the side of the debate which I support.
The book might not change your opinion, but it did to mine. No one KNOWS what is going through someone's head when they are in a "vegetative" state. Nothing can be proven yet, so this is all hypothetical, but if indeed she were alive inside her shell, and somehow knowledgable of everything that transpired during her last moments, I'm sure she probably would have wanted to be put down.
Plenty of people die every day, but we (as a society) have gotten so used to hearing it, only unique spins on the idea will draw our attention.
Perhaps we should be looking at why it is that this particular issue bugged us so much that we had to write all these words and get so indignant?
Most of us are afraid- afraid of the consequences of actions. Actions that rendered somone into a state where thier life was controlled by thier family, thier loved ones, and the government. That's a scary thought, and one worthy of discussion.
It's almost a forshadow, if you will, of darker times, when freedom and life arn't as valued, except in numbers and figures. When you can break down human existence into 3 or 4 catagories and truely say (even though breath still exists) that a person is dead before thier body is- than when will the line be drawn?
If I choose not to have children, and not to work, and not to talk, and I choose to sit on a hill and eat grass for the rest of my life and not acknowldege anyone, am I dead then?
Terri didn't have a choice. A lot of people don't have a choice.
The media singled her out paritally because they thought it would bring rating, which is disgusting, but also, because it brings up a very important issue which everyone has to face- What defines life?

The pope is on his death bed right now- does that mean he is dead already? If so- we're all dead, and just waiting for that final indication.
Since we (including myself here) DONT know everything, how can we pass judgement? Well, we can, but it won't be fair. Ok. Life's not fair.
Fair enough.
But to say that a person DESERVES to die is beyond the line of fair and unfair- it's wrong. Who's to say when the time is right for another man?
People die every day? Sure- of natural causes. If we can prevent that, then we're all the better for that... but if we assist death, it takes nature out of the equation.

There are so many moral issues here, it's hard to even have a consistent opinion. I agree with points from both sides, because the lines here are hazy. The only thing I do know, without a doubt, is that <b>everything</b> was NOT done to the full extent in order to find out what should be done. Who can blame them though? When it comes to an issue like that, who do you turn to? Who has the answers?

I just hope that Terri is thought of in a respectful and human menner.
Comparing her to a carrot in the first place is a great way to mask your fear by alienating any relation to her human qualities, but I still think of her as a woman trapped inside her body, and killed without her consent.

It may have been the most merciful thing, yes, but I guess I can only say I wish there had been another way.

And Halo, I'm pretty happy with my life, and I think it's pretty easy to do that... My opinion changes daily- new information can easily adjust someones views. If you are unable to change your opinion, all that means (in my own humble opinion) is that you already have dignified yourself as "right and true" and no longer need to condsider what if's and if's.
I'm not slamming your system of weighing alternatives, but I do think you should be a little less rigid in your thinking process.

-Logan-
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 10:50pm

Post 47 of 76

Hybrid-Halo

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Maybe wink Any good arguer has to accept that he may be wrong, or unknowing of fact/theory that may change his opinion. wink

And I didn't really notice your name was Logan, in my last sentence "we've got it easier than Logan" I was referring to a film called "Logan's run" which is set in a society that kills people over 40. smile
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 10:55pm

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Madmanmatty

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LMAO! That's a fantastic coincidence!
Great movie too- they're doing a remake, I believe.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 11:51pm

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Aculag

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AcjPictures wrote:

Aculag why did you quote we saying stuff? That doesn't really make sense to me please explain.
Because I didn't want to have to keep the entire post in my quote. Everyone knew what I was talking about. Don't be offended.

In response to everyone saying "you only get to live once", that's true! HOWEVER! Let's consider God's great plan. If everything happens for a reason, she was meant to die 15 years ago. However, that also brings up the question of, if everything happens for a reason, why did men create these machines that can keep people in states like these for so long without them dying? However, THAT brings up the problem that if everything happens for a reason, why wouldn't God have just made people live forever anyway?

If it was God's infinite plan to have people be able to live very long lives without the help of machines, he would have done it that way. Unfortunately, in this case, I believe Terry Schiavo was supposed to die 15 years ago, but with the brilliant and constructive ideas of man, she didn't.

This case resembles the Scott Peterson case. It's just another person who died, but for some goddamn reason, the whole world has to know about it. I didn't care about Scott or Laci Peterson, and I don't care about Terry Schiavo. Call me insensitive. Maybe I am, but these people's lives is none of my concern. I have never met them, never will, never want to. When one of my friends or family members is dying, or dies, or gets their feeding tube removed, then I'll care.

I feel the same way about things like this that I feel about the exloitation of celebrities by the paparazzi. They're just people. I don't go around my city trying to make huge news stories out of every little thing.
Posted: Fri, 1st Apr 2005, 11:56pm

Post 50 of 76

LilCaesars

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Oh I get the stuff now I was just looking at my previous posts and never saw stuff I get it now though.
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 1:01am

Post 51 of 76

Mr Pencil

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Aculag wrote:

Let's consider God's great plan. If everything happens for a reason, she was meant to die 15 years ago.
Aculag, though I agree with you on this controversial topic, what you failed to see is that according to "God's Great Plan" Terri wasn't supposed to die 15 years ago. Everything that happens is perfect, no matter how devistating. What God wanted to do by keeping her alive is...well...God's own mysterious ways.
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 1:14am

Post 52 of 76

Madmanmatty

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Mister Pencil wrote:

Aculag wrote:

Let's consider God's great plan. If everything happens for a reason, she was meant to die 15 years ago.
Aculag, though I agree with you on this controversial topic, what you failed to see is that according to "God's Great Plan" Terri wasn't supposed to die 15 years ago. Everything that happens is perfect, no matter how devistating. What God wanted to do by keeping her alive is...well...God's own mysterious ways.
Well, actually, mankind, according to Catholic belief is a species of free will, and our actions are made by us and us alone. Otherwise, if god controlled everything, there would be no reason for hell, for we would all be good. According to that belief, God's only real plan was to give us the ability to think and do as we please, and punish us if we do wrong; while uplifitng the rightous, because they didn't have to do good.
So technically, with that belief in mind, it wasn't part of the "big plan".

-Logan-
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 1:32am

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Pooky

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Ah but god doesn't punish the wrongdoers, the Devil does.

(I give this 2 pages until it turns into an America vs world debate)
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 1:41am

Post 54 of 76

Mr Pencil

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Madmanmatty wrote:

Well, actually, mankind, according to Catholic belief is a species of free will, and our actions are made by us and us alone. Otherwise, if god controlled everything, there would be no reason for hell, for we would all be good. According to that belief, God's only real plan was to give us the ability to think and do as we please, and punish us if we do wrong; while uplifitng the rightous, because they didn't have to do good.
So technically, with that belief in mind, it wasn't part of the "big plan".
Well, the way you interpreted what I said was incorrect.
God's Great Plan is only for God himself to understand (as I stated) but it is through the free will of man that this is completed. Free will allows people to want Terri alive, and free will allows people that wanted her dead. Somehow, God is using this to teach a lesson. That's his plan.

pooky wrote:

Ah but god doesn't punish the wrongdoers, the Devil does.
Exactly, Pooky. It perfectly correlates with your sig too:

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 2:14am

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Madmanmatty

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But you see, God is America, and American hates the Afgahnistan because they come first in the dictionary, so America blows them up and now they just need to get Africa and Advania and their dictionary domination will be complete.


lol- you're so right Pooky.





Hell is removal from god's light (according to Dante's Inferno)
(I couldn't resist)
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 2:44am

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Coureur de Bois

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evman101 wrote:



orion0340 wrote:
Im sure glad it's not the only thing on the news anymore. I'm just really sick of hearing about the whole situation.
This really makes me mad. You are so heartless you want someone to die so you can see a new headline on the news. I can see a little more with those who believe it was pointless because she was a vegetable, but you got bored of hearing it. Honestly do you care for anyone in your life? We spend all of our time trying to advance ourselves in life and gain ground, but we will easily through someone elses life away because it doesn't affect us right. I just think you should have a little more consideration for the people it involves and less for yourself and what bores you and pleases you.
UGH... wow... so we're supposed to spend the rest of our lives feeling sad for her? She died... OH WELL people die every day and no one cares. The only reason why this is special is because it was overblown by the media. You're making this some special case, but you don't know 99.9999% of the people who die every day. Suck it up.
what evman said. AcjPictures: you really need to lay off with the righteous act. It's not fooling anybody.
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 2:54am

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Pooky

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Ooh! ooh! read the quote in my sig!
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 5:35am

Post 58 of 76

BackOfTheHearse

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pooky wrote:

Ah but god doesn't punish the wrongdoers, the Devil does.
Oh really? What about this?

Amos Chapter 2
--2:2 But I will send a fire upon Moab, and it shall devour the palaces of Kirioth: and Moab shall die with tumult, with shouting, and with the sound of the trumpet:
--2:3 And I will cut off the judge from the midst thereof, and will slay all the princes thereof with him, saith the LORD.


I am only going to post that one, but there are many many more instances in both Testaments where God is the one who inflicts the punishment. According to your bible, HE is the one who casts non-followers into the lake of fire.


Lastly, the subject of free will: according to God's definition, free will is negated. If god is all-knowing, he knows the past, present, and future. Therefore, he would know what choices you're going to make already. Thus, no matter what you "decide" on to choose, it was already predestined anyway.

Here's an idea...

God placed the Tree of Knowledge into the Garden of Eden, which would give Adam and Eve the knowledge of Good and Evil. He placed it in there KNOWING that they would eat from it, and he punished them for an "evil" act before they could have possibly been able to comprehend it.
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 6:19am

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Madmanmatty

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And god knows that in 25 years I will go back in time and kill my grandmother, causing a paradox which will unravel the threads of the universe.
We're quoting scripture now. I suggest everyone just go watch Dogma, have a smoke, commit some sins, think about what this all means, and drop the subject.
I feel like we've lost the point. This is what religion does- it makes people fight. We shouldn't fight.
It seems most of us are just trying to get some of our fears and concerns out there to deal with them.. that's helpful.
But it's getting to the point where it's not helping, it's hurting.
We shouldn't critize each other's beliefs, we should lay ours on the table and hope that maybe when someone reads them, they either gain a new perspective, or become more deeply satisfied in thier own.
I personally don't believe in "destiny" in the traditional sense. I don't believe in "God" in the traditional sense. I'm writing a few scripts that bring those views out. Everyone who has posted here has a slightly different view on this whole issue. It's not wrong, it's not bad- it's something that happens when you process information. A view comes out. It's nice to see other people's views, even if you disagree. That way, your own view can change a little, if you stay open-minded and process the new information.

I started out here thinking just of Terri.. that's what the thread was about- just Terri. Then the children in Africa, and the soldiers in Iraq, and the homeless people came in, and it totally generalized the whole thing.

I think about those things a lot. My girlfriend used to make fun of me, because she asked one time what I had been thinking about during a carnal act. I said, "The color red... and the children in Africa" I wasn't joking- I have ADD, and my mind wanders sometimes. It wasn't the smoothest thing to say, granted, but I ain't no smoothie. Now how does that fit in?

I think about those things alot. But I can't do anything. I can't afford to finacially help, and I have no time to volunteer. Otherwise I can't eat, and I can't pay rent. Hopefully, I'll be able to make films, so that people who can make a difference, do. That's one thing I'd like to accomplish through cinema (which this is a forum for).

But that's the steam in the air, and we all feel it's heat, but the boiling issue here was Terri, and she's been forgotten in all this hub-ub. I know, I know. She's just a vegtable.
Well, Jesus was just a man. Sure, the whole son of god thing helped, if you believe the bible. But then again- Jesus did say we're ALL children of God. And every religion agrees on that one. So, whether the Bible is a true story, or a biased account, Jesus was still a freaking wise dude, and he did a lot of really great things. And then he died.
And the media of the times made a big freaking deal about that.
You can't sweep things like this under the rug- it's a good cultural example of how we view things these days.
Now, I'm not comparing Terri to Jesus (so before you nuts start furiously typing, listen), but one person can make a difference. Jesus changed a lot of things through his example. Now let's apply that here.
Here's a question:
What can be done to prevent something like this?
Should there be laws showing a hierchy of descision making?
Should people be making sure to include a decision in a will in case it happens to them?
Who decides finally?

Let's put aside our differences and talk about solutions, not problems.


-Logan-
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 5:28pm

Post 60 of 76

Mr Pencil

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pooky wrote:

(I give this 2 pages until it turns into an America vs world debate)
I give it 1 page untill it turns into the next Holy War.
Posted: Sat, 2nd Apr 2005, 6:28pm

Post 61 of 76

Aculag

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Mister Pencil wrote:

pooky wrote:

(I give this 2 pages until it turns into an America vs world debate)
I give it 1 page untill it turns into the next Holy War.
I declare holy war on Mister Pencil.

Edit: Page 5 Jihad snypaz 4 lyfe
Posted: Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 8:24am

Post 62 of 76

LtMcMurphy

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Rating: +1

I didnt read this thread at all but Im guessing its full of 16 year old canadians telling everyone how bad america is confirm/deny
Posted: Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 4:29pm

Post 63 of 76

cinemafreak

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Rating: -1

LtMcMurphy wrote:

I didnt read this thread at all but Im guessing its full of 16 year old canadians telling everyone how bad america is confirm/deny


Never mind. People have no sense of humor these days.

Last edited Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 7:24pm; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 5:12pm

Post 64 of 76

Madmanmatty

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Rating: -2

Rating removed... next time... use something to indicate it's a joke-
Text doesn't convey emotion that well..

As a side note, I got a little mad, I'm sorry- but it really wasn't obviously a joke, and expressing one's views is one thing, but it just seemed a little out of hand.

Ah forget it, no harm done. Sorry 'bout the confusion, but I'm pretty sensitive about the whole Canada thing.. I got miffed, don't hold it against me, mates.

-Logan-

Last edited Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 12:36am; edited 2 times in total.

Posted: Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 5:49pm

Post 65 of 76

cinemafreak

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Madmanmatty wrote:

Wrong- it's full of intelligent people from all corners of the world having a debate about something that is a topical issue- however it seems that you represent exactly what you are trying to convey.

America isn't that bad- I like it alot. Not the politics... however... the people like you who live in it are the source of most of it's reputation... well, that and it's excessive use of force.

Do yourself a favor and kindly don't open your mouth..

BIOTCH!!
WTF dude!! I swear! Whats up with the negative rating? This board is full of people with no sense of humor. Canada is cool, I like it. I was just joking when I made that post! mad
Posted: Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 6:25pm

Post 66 of 76

Hybrid-Halo

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Maybe now is a good time for me to point at the thread topic and remind people they need to stick to it.

"Stay on target!"

Last edited Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 4:54am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Sun, 3rd Apr 2005, 11:13pm

Post 67 of 76

LtMcMurphy

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

Maybe now is a good time for me to point at the thread topic and remind people they need to stick to it.

Once again, McMurphy's wacky sense of humour leads a thread off topic.
*sighs*

"Stay on target!"
that armor is too strong for blasters
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 1:25am

Post 68 of 76

Hybrid-Halo

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LtMcMurphy wrote:

that armor is too strong for blasters
Cut the Chatter. wink
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 2:49am

Post 69 of 76

Aculag

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

LtMcMurphy wrote:

that armor is too strong for blasters
Cut the Chatter. wink
You DO realize that you (a) started it, and (b) are contributing to it... Do you not? And only when McMurphy said something off topic. Interesting. It was Pooky who started the "America vs. World" thing, Mister Pencil continued it, I continued it, then McMurphy continued it.

So it was not "McMurhpy's wacky sense of humour" that led this thread off topic, it was Pooky's comment.
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 3:49am

Post 70 of 76

LtMcMurphy

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

LtMcMurphy wrote:

that armor is too strong for blasters
Cut the Chatter. wink
watch that crossfire boys
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 4:51am

Post 71 of 76

Hybrid-Halo

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LtMcMurphy wrote:

Hybrid-Halo wrote:

LtMcMurphy wrote:

that armor is too strong for blasters
Cut the Chatter. wink
watch that crossfire boys
Almost there...

Aculag wrote:

You DO realize that you (a) started it, and (b) are contributing to it... Do you not? And only when McMurphy said something off topic. Interesting. It was Pooky who started the "America vs. World" thing, Mister Pencil continued it, I continued it, then McMurphy continued it.

So it was not "McMurhpy's wacky sense of humour" that led this thread off topic, it was Pooky's comment.
I probably was a bit too quick to jump at McMurphy, but his post was the only one which provoked an aggressive reaction. The catalyst of what lead to potential problems if you will.
Not to worry, all seems sorted. 'You're all clear, kid.'
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 5:25am

Post 72 of 76

LtMcMurphy

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

LtMcMurphy wrote:

Hybrid-Halo wrote:

LtMcMurphy wrote:

that armor is too strong for blasters
Cut the Chatter. wink
watch that crossfire boys
Almost there...

Aculag wrote:

You DO realize that you (a) started it, and (b) are contributing to it... Do you not? And only when McMurphy said something off topic. Interesting. It was Pooky who started the "America vs. World" thing, Mister Pencil continued it, I continued it, then McMurphy continued it.

So it was not "McMurhpy's wacky sense of humour" that led this thread off topic, it was Pooky's comment.
I probably was a bit too quick to jump at McMurphy, but his post was the only one which provoked an aggressive reaction. The catalyst of what lead to potential problems if you will.
Not to worry, all seems sorted. 'You're all clear, kid.'
Attack pattern delta. GO DACK
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 5:42am

Post 73 of 76

Aculag

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

Not to worry, all seems sorted. 'You're all clear, kid.'
Alright then. Let's blow this thing and go home!
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 5:48am

Post 74 of 76

Madmanmatty

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So how about that technology, eh?


smile
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 5:52am

Post 75 of 76

A Pickle

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Well... on the topic of Terri Schiavo... I believe that it was a huge blunder in the face of humanity.

The question regarding the morality of extending her life or canceling her suffering were both answered by the flaming hypocrisy of how it was solved. To me, this was a blatant slap and a step backwards in the annals of the issue of euthanasia.

The decision was made to remove her feeding tube. Ah yes. Indeed, let us end her suffering, for her own dignity and self-being, by starving her to death. Indeed, hypocrisy wins this day.

The Schiavo family has also lost points with me, as they allegedly accused Mr. Michael Schiavo as only wanting the money he would recieve if indeed Terri passed. That in and of itself was family betrayal. It seems some people cannot agree to disagree, and the Schiavo family strikes below the belt at the man they entrusted their daughter to live the rest of her life with.

My philosophical and moral views of brotherhood and kinship aside, I believe that an individual should have the right to choose his or her own fate, and should that individual become incapable of choice, that based upon the observations and data collected by our doctors, family members should be allowed to choose.

This is merely my own banter on a topic I became quickly opinionated in, and personally, I found both sides ultimately in the wrong.
Posted: Mon, 4th Apr 2005, 6:29pm

Post 76 of 76

Aculag

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A Pickle wrote:

My philosophical and moral views of brotherhood and kinship aside, I believe that an individual should have the right to choose his or her own fate, and should that individual become incapable of choice, that based upon the observations and data collected by our doctors, family members should be allowed to choose.
So do you not consider her husband to be a family member?