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trying out the product

Posted: Sat, 17th Sep 2005, 5:51pm

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ashman

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hi there,
im trying out chromonator. im not too sure what im doing, im using the quick start guide but feel a little let down by the program. im aware this is because of my lack of knowledge so find even more fustrating. right ive got a chrome! tank rolling on a green back ground. i also filmed a person walking in the garden, i put the two together and i get a really anoying green line, i tried the garbage matte and because the tank moves find it hard to keyframe,although with more time could be better, plus the tank is chrome so the green is mirrored all over it. how do i get that green line of, i did the other thing where it puts a black line . mmm im a noob, please help.i need some simple step by step instructions. am i trying to do some thing that is to hard. i cant find the demo one to use.
Posted: Sat, 17th Sep 2005, 6:56pm

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Wizard

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ashman69ergude wrote:

i put the two together and i get a really anoying green line
Is it possible for you to post a screen caption to give us a better idea of where and how this green line is occurring? Having a chrome tank may also add to the difficulty, but as long as parts of the tank are not being keyed out, then I see no problem with that at the moment.

If you want to start with something a little easier, you can download the example videos used in the quick start guide, found here. That should be a little better to start with. As I said earlier, in regards to your tank issue, please post a screen caption if possible, and you may get better results. Chromanator can take some time to get use to, so try to be patient, and I hope you figure this one out.

Have fun.
Wizard.
Posted: Sat, 17th Sep 2005, 7:07pm

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ashman

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Hi, i managed to get the effect right but only in adobe premiere pro. it was easy,is pro better than chromanator is it more powerful? im not sure as im new to these types of programes. although when i put it through pro the green sceen layer looked a little transparent and the background plate a little dark. im not to sure how to post film clips or pictures to show you what i mean with the green line in chromanator. all i know is i get a thin green line around the edge of the tank? im sorry if im not clear as im still inexperianced
Posted: Sat, 17th Sep 2005, 7:48pm

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Wizard

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ashman69erdude wrote:

is pro better than chromanator is it more powerful?
I am un-certain. I myself have had no experience working with Adobe Premiere Pro. So I am un-able to provide an answer to that question. I have heard many things about how Chromanator compares to programs such as Adobe Premiere Pro, and I have the impression that Chromanator does a fine job holding its own, so to speak.

I find I get great results working with Chromanator, but that does not mean that will apply for you as well. The green line you spoke is taken care of by adding a "Spill Suppression". By the sounds of your other post, I am assuming that you have tried this.

To limit this black line that results from using spill suppression, you need to set your Black and White points to the correct setting. Unfortunately I can not tell you what this would be for your tank, because it varies for every composite. Once you have set these to the exact points, turn on spill suppression, and then select "Extended" for better results, and color correction. As for which one is more powerful, perhaps a member with an objective point of view, and the experience with both, can tell you the answer to that.

If you want to host pictures for upload to these forums, you need a hosting site, I tend to use a free one, which is not hard for picture files. I use “Image Shack”, found here. You simply upload the picture that meets the requirements, then find a link out the list of links they supply, and copy it. You would have to post the image using "BBCode"; just click here to see the help page on writing "BBCode". If you are un-aware of how to take a screen caption, feel free to ask. You can private message me if you prefer, I don't mind at all.

Best of luck.
Wizard.
Posted: Sat, 17th Sep 2005, 8:01pm

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ashman

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thanks for the help wizard you truely are a great help. i think the problem is my greenscreen, using the footage you supplied me was easy to key in chromanator. i was using a flouresent green poster paper (the high glow stuff) the green used in the footage in the demo was a pale green. im not sure. also because when i do my shoot for my movie, is it best to use blue, im filming alot of fields and having a finished tank thats green im worried of keying out the wrong parts. i did hear blue was not as good as green, ive also heard that is a myth. i will try to post the green ive used to you.
Posted: Sat, 17th Sep 2005, 8:22pm

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Wizard

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ashman69erdude wrote:

im filming alot of fields and having a finished tank thats green im worried of keying out the wrong parts.
If you have any green, other then your green screen, in the frame, you will most likely end up keying out that object along with your green screen. Depending on how dark (different) the other green is, you may be able to get away with it, but it will limit how much you can alter your white and black points.

Shiny green screening material can also make it difficult, yes. Getting a great composite is kind of worked down to a science. There may be things that seem insignificant to you at the time, but these small things may end up ruining your entire piece of footage, so be careful.

ashman69erdude wrote:

i did hear blue was not as good as green, ive also heard that is a myth.
No, no myth. DV cameras do apparently pick up green data better. As to why this is, I am not sure. I am not an expert when it comes to green screening or DV cameras, but I have read this in several posts, and I believe they were all from rather reputable sources.

Again, if you have green in your shot, blue is the way to go. However, it works the same both ways, for obvious reasons. You may want to avoid having other objects with the same color of the screen you are using in the shot all together. Try not to include (Green for example) until you acquire multiple screens of different colors, and are capable of changing between them.

ashman69erdude wrote:

thanks for the help wizard
You are very welcome.
Wizard.
Posted: Sun, 18th Sep 2005, 8:35am

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ashman

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here is a link to that green screen im using i think it may be too green? im not sure. what do you guys think?

im not to good with the loading pictures stuff, i hope this works
[/url]
Posted: Sun, 18th Sep 2005, 8:40am

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ashman

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I forgot to say, when i key the demo in chromantor(trail version) its easy, i try doing this its really difficult, is it because, on the demo the outline is black of the guy in the cloak, so its easy to key, my tank is chrome and the green reflects of it, if i apply a spill suppression it gets a really bad black line around it. whats the best way to sort this problem out
Posted: Sun, 18th Sep 2005, 9:13am

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Hendo

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ashman69erdude wrote:

if i apply a spill suppression it gets a really bad black line around it. whats the best way to sort this problem out
If you can, it may be worth increasing the distance between your tank and the green background and floor. That way you can light the greenscreen seperately from your tank, and with the extra distance there will be less spillage / reflection.

That's easy to do if you've only got a background; but since you also have a floor that you want to roll the tank on, it gets a bit harder to lift it off the ground and still make the tank's wheels appear that they are moving.

One solution would be to hang the tank by fishing line / thin wires. You can easily mask out the wires using Chromy. Are the wheels battery-controlled or do you just give it a push? If they are battery-controlled then that makes it easy; just start them up and the wheels will rotate in mid-air. Otherwise you could just manually give the wheels a flick to get them rotating.

As a result, though, you will have footage of the tank with its wheels rotating, but not actually moving forward. So you'd have to use Chromy's quad animation tools to make the tank appear as if it's moving towards the camera (or whatever direction the tank is facing).

With the tank distanced enough from both the background and the floor, and lighting the subject and background carefully and separately, I reckon you'll get a much better result.
Posted: Sun, 18th Sep 2005, 9:47am

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ashman

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great! thats helped lots, thank you very much, my last question in this thread is: ive got my background plate, a landscape view, the bottom half of fields and hedges and a few buildings and people. And the top half, a blue shy with clouds. My final effect to go over the background plate is a green tank. but im struggling to get a straight anwser what background colour to use, im told blue would be better due to all the greenary in the shot, but what about the blue sky. is there a specific colour blue and green to use? should i use a different colour altogether? im a little stuck as i have blue and green in the background plate. any one out there have this problem before. What should i do?
Posted: Sun, 18th Sep 2005, 10:07am

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Hendo

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Rating: +1

ashman69erdude wrote:

im a little stuck as i have blue and green in the background plate. any one out there have this problem before. What should i do?
When keying out a colour, your choice of blue or green behind the subject (i.e. your tank) has nothing to do with whatever replacement background you want to put in behind your subject.

If I'm understanding you correctly, your background movie consists of some green bushes, some buildings, and a blue sky. The colours in this footage have nothing to do with the green/blue that you use as a background in your tank footage.

For keying out your tank you can use either a blue or green background. Your choice of green/blue in your tank footage has no effect on your movie background, regardless of what colours are in your movie background.

Green is much better for keying footage from MiniDV cameras, since more information is recorded for the green channel. Because there is more information to work with, you'll get a better result from keying green.
Posted: Sun, 18th Sep 2005, 1:46pm

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Wizard

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ashman69erdude wrote:

should i use a different colour altogether? im a little stuck as i have blue and green in the background plate.
Sorry, the way I worded my post may have given you the wrong idea about what I meant; perhaps I should have specified which footage you have to be careful of when using certain colors. Hendo’s first sentence says it all.

Hendo wrote:

When keying out a colour, your choice of blue or green behind the subject (i.e. your tank) has nothing to do with whatever replacement background you want to put in behind your subject.
You only have to worry about your screen being the same color as objects you are filming in front of your screen. In other words, you only have to worry about the colors you are using in your "green screen object". Sorry I did not make that clear enough, but Hendo did a fine job re-wording it.

Thanks Hendo, plus one.
Wizard.