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What would be better?

Which choice would be better?

Canon GL1 and Macbook19%[ 4 ]
Canon GL233%[ 7 ]
Other48%[ 10 ]

Total Votes : 21

Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 5:29am

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Thrawn

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Hey there

This summer I am saving up for some filmaking gear. I was thinking of buying a Macbook (With FCE pre-installed on it...) and a Canon GL1. But then I thought it might be better just to skip the Mac and buy a Canon GL2. So I am pretty much stuck. So if some of you could give your input on which choice would be best that would be great!

Thanks

-Thrawn
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 5:38am

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SilverDragon7

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Well the Canon GL1 and the MacBook.

Because at least with that you can have semi-great fottage and super editting.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 5:07pm

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Thrawn

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Thanks for you input SilverDragon7.

Anyone else have an opinion??
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 5:29pm

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Penguin

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Well I don't have any experience with those cameras but I've got a macbook and it's pretty awesome.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 5:45pm

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Bryce007

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Gl1's aren't really all that better than a 2007 model single chip Sony DV camera....


If your current computer can handle editing, I'd say stick with that and buy the better camera.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 6:53pm

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Plainly

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I agree with Bryce. Buy the good camera instead of more editing softwear. Then you could buy something like SonyVegas which is only about $100 (I think), and it seems to me it does very good editing. I don't actually own it, but I tried the demo and it seemed very good.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 6:58pm

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Thrawn

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Well the reason I wanted another computer is that mine really is cruddy. It has an 80GB hardrive, less then a GB of memory, and has a poor graphics card. I am getting vegas soon but my computer will barely support it. That's the reason I wanted a new computer but if it would be more helpful to my filmaking experience then I'll go with the better camera.

Thanks for the input.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 10:19pm

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Bryce007

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In that case, Buy an expensive 16x9 capable single chip Camera (Or a used gs500) and spend the rest on a Computer.

For a single Chip camera, you can pick up a Sony HC-7 for about $1100. Because it's HD capable, the SD video looks pretty great for a single chip. It's also 16X9 and has manual focus. And you can switch over to HDV mode if you want to get some REALLY nice looking pictures (As long as you don't plan on having much movement in the shot...)
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 11:39pm

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Sollthar

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Cameras are overrated. A good, solid, stable and pleasant editing experience is worth much more then slightly better colorsampling for 1000 $ more.

I'd say pick a good computer (imac if you can afford it, laptops are not really the best choice for movie editing) and spend the rest on a camera - if your current one is bad or dying.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 11:54pm

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Bryce007

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Aha. I didn't realize you already OWN a camera. nevermind then....Opt fully for a computer. The TRV18 has a flat picture, but that's what color correction and grading are for.
Posted: Sat, 28th Apr 2007, 11:55pm

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Sollthar

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It was an assumption from "current filmmaking gear".

But yeah, good computers with good software are more important then a fancy camera for a pleasant filmmaking experience.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 12:12am

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FreshMentos

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I would try to get a better camera than the the GL1. As for the macbook, I love them. But I don't think that they are very good for video editing (small screen, mediocre graphics card, and just not powerful enough). You should look into a Macbook Pro, an iMac, or Mac Pro. The iMac would be the cheapest (I just bought a 20" iMac and it is great!).

Here's an idea: Get an iMac with at least 2.0GHz, one of Panasonic's GS series camcorders, and get FCE. That is the cheapest thing that I can think of. Hope it helped!
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 12:27am

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doppelganger

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Well early I was thinking about getting a macbook but the fact is its to much $ for to little power. Id say go for a pc notebook and load and I bet you it will be more powerful and around the same price as a macbook. I was going to get a mac just for FCE but its just not worth in you could get sony vegas studio (100$) and Fxlab/composite/vision and you would be set. As for the camera its really what your looking for just make sure it has a mic input that was my big mistake, now I have to record sound seperatly and synce it.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 2:22am

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Thrawn

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Thanks everyone for the advice. I do have a current camera just not a very great one. I was thinking of getting an Macbook because I travel often and would like to bring my editing with me, but I see your point about better editing with a bigger screen.

Sollthar wrote:

I'd say pick a good computer (imac if you can afford it, laptops are not really the best choice for movie editing) and spend the rest on a camera
What would be the next best camera then a GL1?? I mean if I did not have the money left over for a GL1 then what would be the next best thing? I have heard the Panasonic GS series is second best but alot of them don't have mic inputs....
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:10am

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Atom

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I've had horrible trouble with the GSs on my school broadcast class. For the price, I'd say they aren't worth it and you should look into a one-chip Sony dv camera.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:12am

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Thrawn

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Alright I know this sounds really n000bish but what is a one-chip camera??
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:21am

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ben3308

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1 chip = 1 CCD = 1 color sensor. The GL1 and GL2 and more expensive miniDV cameras are all 3CCDs in that they have different color sensors to pick up all the color; whereas a cheaper camera has one.

I dunno what this mess about getting a better computer is. You can pretty much edit on any stable (very loose term, here!) computer with software that allows you to split, cut, trim, and edit; but you can't fake picture quality.

Maybe upgrade your computer or stick with it and see if you can run a cheaper NLE like Sony MovieStudio or Video Explosion with a GL2 to shoot with.

Color grading footage will only get you so far, and if it's from a worse color, lower range camera, especially a 1-chip, it'll be noticeable. Whereas if fyou edit on your current machine versus a new machine, in the final product nobody will know the difference.

Buy the GL2. Or something better. But don't settle for less, then you're just selling yourself short.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:24am

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Bryce007

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It's only got one Imaging chip. Prosumer/pro camera's use three imaging chips.


Good single chip camera's:

Sony HDR-HC7

Sony HDR-HC1



Type those in Amazon.com or Pricegrabber.com to check them out. Both are less then $1500, 16x9, and High definition capable. Which means you can downscale the HDV to normal MiniDV and it's going to look VERY nice. (Plus, they've got decent manual controls.)
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:28am

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Thrawn

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So it would be better to get a 3CCD camera instead of a Single Chip?? I'll check the camera's out you mentioned Bryce007 but I don't see why a GL1 would be better because it's 3CCD... those camera's would be an upgrade to my current camera correct??
The main thing I am looking for in a camera is good quality, a mic input, and it would have to be better then my current one...


ben3308, Thanks for the info!
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:40am

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Bryce007

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The GL1 might have 3 chips, but I've used one before, and it was basically the same image the Sony TRV27 (Single chip) It was being matched with was putting out.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:49am

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Serpent

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Whatever anyone here says, hear this: if you get a GL1, it will be used. You will not have a warranty and it will not last long as it is old. The image quality is fine, but if it gets damaged in any way, Canon charges and arm and a leg for repairs. Just listen to what everyone else is saying: go for the low end Sony HDV cams or stick with what you have. Any camera that is that decent is capable of jumpstarting a film career if you have the talent. And if you're not into that, it will produce nice images. I'd spend the rest of your budget on upgrading your desktop, or selling you desktop and getting a nice Mac. If you are upgrading, get a bigger internal HD, some RAM, maybe upgrade your video card. If you're going for a Mac, I'd go for an iMac for editing. Of course, there are plenty of options besides these.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 4:13am

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Kid

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Well my advice is that the sony vx2100 totally owns now. Its cheaper than it used to be. The canons are suffering from all sorts of tape problems now that were unknown before. (If you really insist on getting one use a cheap camera as a tape deck or get a dedicated one) A 3ccd camera is good but as manufacturers have caught onto people looking for them, any old 3ccd won't do. In a lot of cases you would be better off getting the single ccd one. At any rate lenses are probably the biggest actual difference between cameras and its good to check a few out in the shop before you buy.

HDV cameras tend to be a bit sucky and its a format thats in its infancy. I would say unless you have serious money to spend don't bother going for it as to many its just a gimmick.

As to getting a Mac. A lot of people go on about them a lot, but remember its not magic. If you really want one I would at least go for a decent one otherwise a good pc is a lot better value for money.

At the end of the day neither a mac nor a good camera will work miracles and really to get better results the best thing is to learn how to do lighting and use better camera angles and so on. For most people their main audience is going to be the web where you are often restricted to small sizes like 320x240. Learning decent filmmaking skills is gonna come across a lot more than a new camera or editing platform.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 5:40am

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ben3308

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Serpent wrote:

I'd spend the rest of your budget on upgrading your desktop, or selling you desktop and getting a nice Mac.
I could be missing something here- and not to disparage your advice at all, because it is in fact completely valid- but why does he need the extra 'usefulness' of a nice Mac if he's still going to have a completely novice camera? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose?

I mean, if getting a nice Mac is indeed the magic bullet for editing (which I don't disagree in some cases it can be) then why are you guys telling him to cheap out on the camera. Get at least a 3CCD camera, my friend. Do not get anything less. Also pay attention to lenses. Sony has some cheaper 3CCDs out that have smaller Vario-Sonnar(sp?) lenses that don't compare to the larger fluorite or Leica lenses on some of the Canon and Panasonic cameras.

I would really, really think about getting a good, usable, acceptable-for-professional-video-work camera; and IMO, you can't get anything less than a GL1 or GL2 for that, GL2 being of preference of course. Anything more expensive is a plus. If you get a Mac you can have more streamlined editing. Great! But you're still going to have a pretty crap image from your camera.

I've done over 30+ plays and stage performances with my GL2, and the people who contract the videos expect nothing less. I don't get
the deals, my friend does, so we usually use his GL2, mine, and a neighbors. One time we used a GL1 as the third camera and the contract price was docked 75 dollars for the quality difference. So I'd say get the GL2, even though the GL1 is still 3CCD.

So buy a good camera first. Mac second. Upgrade instead, maybe, following what Serpent said.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 5:59am

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Kid

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I think they all have vario sonnar lenses, its something to do with the design rather than the quality as such.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 10:34am

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Sollthar

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It's up to you Thrawn.

Definately care about the good computer first. The camera comes a distant second.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 3:01pm

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Atom

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If he's set out to get a new camera, though, and debating a new computer, why not tell him to go swimming with the camera?

Cameras aren't (usually) upgradeable, computers are. Your computer only has 80GB of space? Add more! Buy an ext. HD! There are a number of things you can do. RAM not enough? Go out and buy some more, granted you have the slots open for more.

Also, and this isn't to get into the mac v. pc debate, but most certainly if you're working on a budget and want to balance getting a camera and a computer, DON'T get a Mac. Not because they aren't terrific, but because I'm betting it's just not for you in your circumstance.

While they are pretty and completely functional and come with some great apps that really make them worth the price of admission, I highly doubt you'll really use them to their fullest, and are much better off for economic and learning-curve reasons to check out some cheaper Dells (yes, Dells, I know) and editing apps like Premiere or Vegas. A basic version of Premiere, Pr. Elements, and a little more than basic version of Vegas, Vegas Movie Studio (which includes DVD Architect for authoring....great app btw), are all available at most electronics stores for a cheaper price, and will offer you fairly powerful and comfortable editing on a cheap, sturdy, powerful PC.

You do what you want, I'm just saying think things through first.
Posted: Sun, 29th Apr 2007, 7:11pm

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Thrawn

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Thanks Sollthar, Atom, Ben3308, and everyone else who gave there opinion. I see everyone's point and it clears up alot for me. I'll post my decision when I make it.
Posted: Mon, 30th Apr 2007, 7:10am

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Corby

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I would recommend upgrading your computer yourself instead of buying a new one from the store. You can save money that way. Last year I bought a new motherboard with a Intel Pentium IV 2.4 ghz processor, 1 GB of Ram for $110. then I bought a Nvidia Geforce FX 6200 video card for $40 from tigerdirect.com. yep self upgrading can be much cheaper if you know where to find the good deals.
Posted: Mon, 30th Apr 2007, 10:03am

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Nutbar

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Ask yourself what do you NEED. If you're working with a large amount of cash go out and splash money on whatever the best of everything you can get within the budget. If you're working on a limited budget which you obviously are then look at what you NEED not what you want. If your computer is not up to scratch then you need a new one, but do you need to spend alot of money getting a decent mac when you could get a PC which would edit the video perfectly well for a fraction of the price?

However a good camera/good computer does not make you a good filmmaker. I would probably buy a decent camera, a decent PC and put the rest of the money towards making a film.
Posted: Wed, 2nd May 2007, 6:59pm

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Merrick

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Well, this thread has helped me a lot too. Thrawn, as for the computer, I upgraded mine from about the same state as yours is in and it fits all of my needs now. The camera advice was very helpful. Does anyone know where I can rent a good camera on a shoestring budget?
Posted: Wed, 2nd May 2007, 7:25pm

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Serpent

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OK, hold it right there Ben. Did you read my post?

I reccomended getting a new camera. If he had the money, he should get at least a low end nicer camera. If he didn't do that, I said he should spend the rest of his money on a computer. Upgrading his PC would be one option, buying a Mac would be another. It's comletely up to him. Nowhere in my post did I say: screw cameras especially the good ones, in fact screw your PC. The only option you have is to buy a Mac, and when you do so, you will be amazing.

By "rest of your budget" I truly did mean what he had left over after he made the decision on a camera. What's the point of having a nice camera if your computer can't handle it at all? That is why I reccomended an upgrade, whether it's upgrading his current PC or buying a new computer altogether. I believe you misunderstood my post.