You are viewing an archive of the old fxhome.com forums. The community has since moved to hitfilm.com.

Rip DVD WITH Subtitles

Posted: Tue, 1st Apr 2008, 12:58pm

Post 1 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi there,

my film is near his final release - at last! smile

Now the problem is, I don't think much of you guys can understand german, so it won't be that funny - so we decided to write subtitles. I'm writing them now in Encore CS3, for our DVD.

Now I need your help smile
When I done the image on my harddrive, what should I do next? I could rip the DVD with subtitles, but I want them to be separately - so everybody who speaks english can activate them, and who understands german can them let deactivated (in WIndows you can make such things with the VLC Player). On this way we just have to upload ONE file for hboth languages.

The problem is: are Mac-Users able to activate/deactivate subtitles within their "favored" software?
And how do I get the subtitles in the file...?
I have a great Encoder für the H.264 Codec that brings the film (actually 1 hour playtime...) to 400MB, in great quality. I don't want you to download 600 and more megabyte for watching our film, I hope it's in your opinion smile

So, I don't know if this is good to understand, but I hope someone can help me.

Thanks, guys!

Regards,
Lucas
Posted: Tue, 1st Apr 2008, 1:12pm

Post 2 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Excellent question.

Firstly, the title is confusing as you want to create not rip, by the sounds of things, and you don't want to do it to DVD, but to a file (with MPEG4 part 10 encoding). But the rest of your post was clear enough!

In what format do you have the subtitles right now? Subtitles are a big pain and not all file formats support them embedded, some do with the addition of an extra subtitle file, etc. It may be easier for you to create a copy with, one without, and offer the choice - the non-German speaking audience won't bother with one, the German speakers will download the other, not many will download both.
Posted: Tue, 1st Apr 2008, 1:18pm

Post 3 of 34

malone

Force: 18242 | Joined: 21st Mar 2001 | Posts: 1477

VisionLab User VideoWrap User PhotoKey 5 Pro User MuzzlePlug User PowerPlug User PhotoKey 3 Plug-in User Windows User

FXhome Team Member

I've not done any subtitling before so I haven't got much advice. But here's a list of popular media players and the subtitle files they support, which might be useful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_media_players#Subtitle_support
Posted: Tue, 1st Apr 2008, 1:43pm

Post 4 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi pdrg,

is there irony in the start of yout post? biggrin
My first thought was to get to an image and than rip it again with any program, which maybe can get the result I want confused
But then when I was writing the comment, I thought that would be kind of stupid, because I would lost quality. I just forgot to change the title biggrin

There some formats I know which can handle subtitles within, for example .mkv (which is "only" a container-format at all). Even my WMP plays it, and this on Vista x64 smile but I don't know if Mac-Users could play it, great pain if they couldn't.

The subtitles aren't any format right know, there are just in Encore; I don't know if I could export them, but I thought it would be possible to rip them from the DVD Image?
The problem with "bot versions" is not the webspace (we got a lot), it's the problem of quality. I wanted to make versions for lower-bandwith users, my little programm brings the 1-hour-movie to 130MB (amazing!). The problem is, if the subs are ON the video-source, they also lost quality; if they are separate, they are the same in each version (at the some resolution - or is this wrong?).

Hi malone,

such a list may be pretty useful, thanks smile

Regards,
Lucas
Posted: Tue, 1st Apr 2008, 2:50pm

Post 5 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Hiya,

Oops, I didn't mean to sound sarcastic! It is a good question, I just wanted to get the title thing out of the way :-$

Your logic is correct, your titles would look degraded after compression down to 130MB, although as fairly static objects MPEG compression will handle them quite well, especially if you use a black strip behind them (although I know this isn't ideal) - try a couple of demos. The big advantage of this way ("burnt-in" subtitles) is that it's easy and solid - the audience do not have to download different players and components to get it to work, so either more people watch your film, or you have fewer support calls! It's less elegant than real closed-caption subtitles I agree, but you're certain it'll work.

I've seen some online players supporting cc subtitles, they may be helpful for streaming, but it may be a bit of trial and error getting friends with international and different computer setups to test if they can enable/disable subtitles on a 20-second sample clip just to be absolutely sure?
Posted: Sun, 6th Apr 2008, 11:35pm

Post 6 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi pdrg,

I'm a jerk, I'm sorry. I just wanted to make shure the movie is on DVD when I answer the next time, this procedure needed more time then I thought, sorry for that unsure

I agree, on this way it's easier to use; I just wanted to make one real big file, for real fans, with great quality, subtitles AND commentary-audiotrack. Just like the DVD, without menu smile but I think you're right; especially it will be better for the FXhome-Cinema, at least it's me who want you to watch the movie as comfortable as possible smile

I thought of making such tests, but I think it's too time consuming.

Now there's a new big Question:
HOW get I the movie WITH subtitles from the DVD? biggrin

Regards,
Lucas
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 9:22am

Post 7 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Yeah, the problem with subtitles, commentries etc in a single file is that it puts demands on the person playing it to have a certain combination of software and filters, etc. Great idea, just quite fiddly to get right, and lots of grey hair supporting people who don't read instructions too :-$

To get the subtitled version off the DVD should be easier though - DVDx is a free download (look for the original site, not some crappy copy) which allows you to rip specific audio tracks, camera angles, and subtitles too, if I remember right. Not fast, but effective smile
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 9:29am

Post 8 of 34

NickF

Force: 2726 | Joined: 4th Jun 2004 | Posts: 933

EffectsLab Pro User MacOS User FXhome Movie Maker

Gold Member

I believe that HandBrake (http://handbrake.fr/) has an option to overlay the subtitles in the final rendered video.
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 12:09pm

Post 9 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi there guys,

I thought of a nicer insider-way than "simple DVD ripping".
When I now think about it, everything else would be nothing different. I'm such a smart guy.... biggrin

So thanks, I'll look for a good ripping program, maybe one that can profit of a Core2Quad wink

Thanks, guys.
So I hope I can be very mysterious when I say:

Be prepared cool [/i]
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 1:26pm

Post 10 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

http://www.labdv.com/dvdx/ is the official site for DVDx - looks like they may have polished it up slightly since I last used it, but you can rip and transcode all in one smooth action smile

And as this is a once-off, don't worry too much about it - it once took me 17 hrs to rip and transcode a 3-hr 2-layer disk huge file, but the compression part of it was probably the most demanding bit - I was going out to a really highly compressed low-loss format, whereas you may want to go to somethinbg in-between (DV?) and do the final compression in your regular tool. Even then, 17 hrs is effectively overnight if you're at work all day anyway
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 2:24pm

Post 11 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Ahhh,

now there comes antoher problem.
DVDx doesn't run on 64bit - I'm using Vista x64.

I think dAVIdeo will work, at least I hope so biggrin
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 4:03pm

Post 12 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Unlucky - sadly that means you're on your own, 'fraid I can't help with x64 sad
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 5:47pm

Post 13 of 34

EvilDonut

Force: 200 | Joined: 22nd Feb 2008 | Posts: 595

Member

How's CS3 with Vista-64?

d
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 6:03pm

Post 14 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Tuffy wrote:

Ahhh,

now there comes antoher problem.
DVDx doesn't run on 64bit - I'm using Vista x64.

I think dAVIdeo will work, at least I hope so biggrin
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=72208
did you try the x64 experimental build?
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 6:16pm

Post 15 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

@pdrg

Not yet - but I will soon smile

@EvilDonut
It's hard to answer this, I think you should ask "exacly" what you wanna know and I'll tell you what I came across - PM, here, wehere ever you like smile
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 6:17pm

Post 16 of 34

EvilDonut

Force: 200 | Joined: 22nd Feb 2008 | Posts: 595

Member

Tuffy wrote:

@pdrg

Not yet - but I will soon smile

@EvilDonut
It's hard to answer this, I think you should ask "exacly" what you wanna know and I'll tell you what I came across - PM, here, wehere ever you like smile
ok. stability, memory usage, speed.

d

Last edited Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 7:26pm; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 7:04pm

Post 17 of 34

Kid

Force: 4177 | Joined: 1st Apr 2001 | Posts: 1876

EffectsLab Lite User VideoWrap User Windows User

Gold Member

If you make vobsub ones most good PC based players will just play them if they are named the same as the video file. Then people can choose to use them or not.
Posted: Mon, 7th Apr 2008, 9:49pm

Post 18 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Kid wrote:

If you make vobsub ones most good PC based players will just play them if they are named the same as the video file. Then people can choose to use them or not.
Would the playback machines need to be
*PC's
*with (and using!) DirectShow
*with VobSub filter installed?

I'd be worried about losing the entire (and disproportionate on this site) Mac audience, or has VobSub moved on?!

Cheers bud smile
Posted: Tue, 8th Apr 2008, 2:19am

Post 19 of 34

Kid

Force: 4177 | Joined: 1st Apr 2001 | Posts: 1876

EffectsLab Lite User VideoWrap User Windows User

Gold Member

No, there are mac players too. There are several players that would just play them (videolan for example) although they would need the vobsub directshow filter for it to work in windows media player.

Most formats will support subtitles but won't play them in the default players. The biggest mainstream format that just works is divx in a .divx container.

Really your best choice for making it accessible to the widest range of people is simply to make a version with subs overlayed permanantly on the footage.
Posted: Thu, 10th Apr 2008, 7:57pm

Post 20 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi there guys,

it's the time - I don't have it -.-
So now I could try DVDx x64 - it doesn't work. It's so dumb to make x64-Video-Software that uses the installed Codecs, because it's very hard to find, install or get them to work. Some other Programs like SUPER can't handle 64bit, anyway; but it isn't only that, it's sort of ultra-buggy - the time of 64bit will come, I'm sure. So I have to search on.

I think I will just make two Version; it's so much easier and takes less time, this is doing the trick.

@Donut

It is stable. My OS was perfectly broken, so I reinstalled it (with SP1 integrated) today; some Programs just didn't worked well, it was Encore and Photoshop (I couldn't make Textlayers...). But I think this was because of this beaten-up Installation, not the OS itself.
Memory usage is great. The Programs can only detect 4GB (because they're 32bit) - I'm using 6GB RAM. One day, Photoshop used 3,9GB for itself, so I had 2GB for other Programs, the PC wasn't slow or something, I was surfing in FF and watching Videos with VLC, no problem! smile
Speed... that's a tricky question. When I installed Vista, the 2Gb I had weren't enough (for me), so I bought 4GB to get 6GB. I can not make a perfect comparsion, but some Animations in After FX rendered the same speed it did in XP 32bit, some seconds more or less. I don't know if it is the same on every PC... I got an Intel Core2Quad, so the speed is damn fast in every case biggrin

Maybe you want me to make some Benchmarks or something - I do, if you like smile
Posted: Thu, 10th Apr 2008, 9:58pm

Post 21 of 34

EvilDonut

Force: 200 | Joined: 22nd Feb 2008 | Posts: 595

Member

Tuffy wrote:



Maybe you want me to make some Benchmarks or something - I do, if you like smile
Nah, if I want >3GB, i'll just buy a Mac. Way easier. smile

d
Posted: Fri, 11th Apr 2008, 9:31am

Post 22 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

EvilDonut wrote:

Tuffy wrote:



Maybe you want me to make some Benchmarks or something - I do, if you like smile
Nah, if I want >3GB, i'll just buy a Mac. Way easier. smile

d
...and maybe a "little bit" expensive.
I know, I simply don't like Apple, but for a Mac with the power of my PC the price were just like my PC plus every Software wink
Posted: Fri, 11th Apr 2008, 10:32am

Post 23 of 34

NickF

Force: 2726 | Joined: 4th Jun 2004 | Posts: 933

EffectsLab Pro User MacOS User FXhome Movie Maker

Gold Member

C'mon guys...

Posted: Fri, 11th Apr 2008, 2:32pm

Post 24 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hehe, great picture biggrin

64bit is not only on my machine because of 6GB RAM, just like because of Programs like VUE with native 64bit-modus. That's simply amazing smile

I really don't want to start the Apple/Windows-War, it's far to difficult, especially with my english biggrin wink
Posted: Fri, 11th Apr 2008, 2:45pm

Post 25 of 34

Kid

Force: 4177 | Joined: 1st Apr 2001 | Posts: 1876

EffectsLab Lite User VideoWrap User Windows User

Gold Member

32bit applications on Mac OS are limited to 2Gb anyway, so no, getting a Mac does not solve all your problems.
Posted: Sat, 12th Apr 2008, 2:11pm

Post 26 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi there,

back to DVDs smile

I tried DVDx on a 32bit System, and I soon I'll getting mad... crazy
The sync of audio/video is cruel, the footage gets terribly interlaced (when I watch it from DVD or even the DV-File, this simply does not happen). And the Quality isn't great at all... (XviD on highest level).
Oh, and the deinterlacing in the Output-Options are ENABLED.

I tried AutoGK, but this isn't good anyway; it makes my movie 16:9 (it is actually 4:3 with letterbox, but not in every scene...), I can't change the aspectratio. And because of that, the Subtitles are cruel (deformaed and stuff).

unsure
Posted: Sat, 12th Apr 2008, 2:59pm

Post 27 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

If you post me a DVD, I'll have a go for you, if that helps? Not sure I'll get any better results, but I can try for you.

The interlaced video is because DVD's are interlaced, but DVD players etc deinterlace on the fly - you can't interlace deinterlaced footage with any kind of meaning. I wonder if you'd be better off ripping to uncompressed AVI (with a heap big drive!), then managing the compression in a proper transcoder like Sorenson, Super or VideoWrap?
Posted: Sat, 12th Apr 2008, 8:37pm

Post 28 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi pdrg,

it's a great offer, but I think you live in the USA, do you? I think I'd have to pay 16$ to send it to you smile

Uncompressed would be fine, but the 32bit-machine here just got 14GB free disc-space, and the movie needs 12GB for the DV-Version... it's simply the problem, that it is async - that simply mustn't.
I would encode it later anyway, with the H.264 AutoEncoder; one hour is 250MB at really good quality wink

Maybe I find something unsure
Posted: Sat, 12th Apr 2008, 8:53pm

Post 29 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

Tuffy wrote:

Hi pdrg,

it's a great offer, but I think you live in the USA, do you? I think I'd have to pay 16$ to send it to you smile

Uncompressed would be fine, but the 32bit-machine here just got 14GB free disc-space, and the movie needs 12GB for the DV-Version... it's simply the problem, that it is async - that simply mustn't.
I would encode it later anyway, with the H.264 AutoEncoder; one hour is 250MB at really good quality wink

Maybe I find something unsure
H.264 is ace - apparently the MPEG4 standard contains some of the funkiest things potentially, including subtitling, but getting a consumer package that supports creating that is tough.

If you don't have an external drive, I strongly reccommend getting one as soon as you can afford it, they're ace. I've got a couple of TB for all those huge video files smile

If you want to give it a try you could always either stick it in the post to me (I'm in the UK), so £8 seems a bit dear for a UK DVD in the post across Europe, I'm sure it'll be less. Or we could try you uploading a disk ISO to yousendit or similar (although it'll be a pretty big file) which I can mount and see if I can use? The offer's there anyway mate
Posted: Sat, 12th Apr 2008, 10:30pm

Post 30 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

Hi there pdrg,

this H.264 is really amazing. The only problem is, that Mac users need VLC, QuickTime can not handle this (at least not from my Encoder, Sollthar tested it for me). My WMP in Vista can play it, but I think every Windows-User should use VLC, it's like using Premiere instead of the Movie Maker biggrin
But it's the compromise: the Mac Users have to get VLC (if they don't have it), but they gel an amazing player AND the movie is better quality as encoded with QuickTime and it's the half of size wink

I don't like external drives; they are loud and sooo slow, at least via USB. I got nearly 1,5TB in my PC, and I have much free space - but not my brother, the guy with the 32bit machine, he uses his PC for Word and stuff (when you work with a Core2Quad and have to encode files on a 3700+ SingleCore... it's simply not cool unsure )

When I send it to the UK, it costs £3,6; I know that, because I just sended something there some days ago. Uploading would be no problem, I got a own FTP (with 10GB Webspace). The problem is my connection; 4GB ISO-Image trough DSL 2000 (the max. upload is 20kbps!) - I'm living with my mom, she's a politician and needs stable internet, so this is an idea, but simply not possible -.-

I now tried dAVIdeo 2007, the Quality isn't that bad, and it's not resizing. It's a bit unsharp, but I try to fix it with Premiere; I would just take an DVDx-DVD-rip from my brother's machine, but because I don't know ehat causes the asynch (might be some kind of false Hz...), so it might be a big waste of time; it's only important to get an good footage, the sound is the same like in the original file, so I could export it from the original DV.
I see - you english-speaking guys get the worst version; ironic is, that you filmmaking guys on FXhome are the ones would like to see it most, I think sad

Regards,
Lucas
Posted: Sat, 12th Apr 2008, 11:34pm

Post 31 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

I use VLC as a matter of course, it's a good player, and hasn't got all the extra rubbish on it that some of the others have. The MOV container format is supposed to support H.264, so that is strange. You could try H.263 instead?

German postage is very expensive - I can post a DVD for £0.32 inland first class and £1-2 to the EU!

I don't mind external drives - USB is fast enough for streaming SD/HDV video, but you can get firewire 400, 800 and eSATA2 too (3Gbps). Noise isn't noticeable to me, in fact I have to look at the LED to check they're spinning sometimes. I like the new Lacie Big Two range - a ready-made RAID which you simply set up for size, speed, robustness per your preferences - so I run them as mirrored pairs to make sure I don't lose data - I've got all the feature SD rushes etc on one, so unless 2 disks crash at once, I'm pretty safe smile

If I can help at all, just shout, otherwise good luck mate smile

P
Posted: Sun, 13th Apr 2008, 12:59am

Post 32 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

My Encoder is not good for details, but the Quality makes me want no other; only H.264, only *.mkv. Former I was using QuickTime for encoding, everythings a little bit different on 64bit. But it's damn slow, and not that great compression; at least I want you guys here to watch an one-hour-movie, it's simply insulting to expect downloading 600MB or something from you, I think confused

One day I looked on your eBay to buy a camera (at least it's PAL), but the guys on ebay wanted £50 for shipment. That's ca. 62€, from that I can buy 500Gb HDD or a good Pol-Circular Filter for a XL2 tard strange thing; I don't know much about politics, because it's not bothering me; but if you trust news on TV and the german "Sun", everythings fucked up here, gets or is already very expensive. When I look on PC Hardware (Graphiccards, CPUs, RAM), things I'm going to buy, I just can't really agree smile

Yeah, I read about Lacie; but that's a price-region a can not afford. I'm using a new System-HDD since Wednesday, before I used a 200GB IDE HDD from about 2004. It's a big step to the future; my Vista performance-index for the System-HDD (I don't know how it's called in english exacly) went from 5,0 to 5,9 biggrin

I'm looking forward to get things right, at least I hope so. In the next few hours I will make a trailer (the most people make them BEFORE the movie is finished - I don't! biggrin ), after that I'll try to fix this DVD-Ripping-Stuff.

Thanks mate, great help smile

Regards,
Lucas
Posted: Sun, 13th Apr 2008, 2:47am

Post 33 of 34

Tuffy

Force: 1105 | Joined: 20th Oct 2006 | Posts: 138

VisionLab User FXpreset Maker FXhome Movie Maker Windows User MacOS User

Gold Member

WAAAAAAHHH!

I just saw I big failure in the film; the subs are a bit out of control at the beginning. The crazy thing is, in Encore everything is okay; very great, my first cool DVD and sums of failures frown
So I'll have to make a new DVD-Image to rip from. Just great mad
Posted: Wed, 16th Apr 2008, 7:06pm

Post 34 of 34

pdrg

Force: 5405 | Joined: 4th Dec 2006 | Posts: 4143

VisionLab User Windows User

Gold Member

One more option -

play the DVD through your DV camera with subtitles on, and capture to DV, then compress and deliver - then the DVD player is managing the subtitling, and your workflow is like any other capture smile