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The XXIX Olympiad in Beijing

Posted: Sun, 10th Aug 2008, 11:38pm

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Coureur de Bois

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Surprised that no one has created a topic for this yet, being an international community and all...

I thoroughly enjoyed the US mens basketball team complete domination Yao Ming and the Chinese and seeing Michael Phelps first gold medal victory of the competition. Who thinks he has it in him to clench all 8 of his events?

So what do you guys think so far?

Edit: watching womens synchronized diving right now. Who else thinks that Chinese superstar is super sexy?

Last edited Sun, 10th Aug 2008, 11:44pm; edited 2 times in total.

Posted: Sun, 10th Aug 2008, 11:42pm

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Bolbi

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Phelps phan i am
Posted: Sun, 10th Aug 2008, 11:49pm

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Zephlon

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I think that opening was AMAZING!!! im waiting for someone to post it on Youtube or for a rerun to show so I can try and figure out how they did some of that stuff
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 12:01am

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FreshMentos

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I've been following the swimming as I myself am a swimmer. Michael Phelps winning the 400 meter individual Medley was amazing. I'm really pissed I missed the basketball game. I think I also missed the U.S. water-polo game too. sad
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 3:03am

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The FE

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Gorion wrote:

Who else thinks that Chinese superstar is super sexy?
This guy right here, thats who, shes aces alright.

What about the American fencing team sweeping the medals, I though that was pretty cool. I always wanted wanted to be a fencer....
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 3:11am

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Atom

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I thought the American Women's Fencing sweeping the medals was cool all the way until they interviewed them and the gold-medal-winner was a total, conceited ass.

"Well, yeah, I tried and trained real hard....so....yeah, what can I say? I deserve it."

I mean, come one. Have some humility, even if you just won an Olympic gold medal. It's for Women's Fencing, buddy, don't let it go to your head. smile

Last edited Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 3:18am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 3:14am

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The FE

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Atom wrote:

I thought the American Women's Fencing sweeping the medals was cool all the way until they interviewed them and the gold-medal-winner was a total, conceited ass.

"Well, yeah, I tried and trained real hard....so....yeah, I deserve it."

I mean, come one. Have some humility, even if you just won an Olympic gold medal. It's for Women's Fencing, buddy, don't let it go to your head. smile
Alright fair enough, she was just a little bit rude about it, but to be fair she was the first woman to win for USA back in Athens or something like that wasnt she? And then she won gold again, so shes has something to be proud of.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 3:20am

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Atom

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Maybe it's just me, but yeah- so she won a gold medal. That's probably all she's done since like age 10 was fencing. People like that don't impress me. I mean, they're dedication does, but when you're just haughty and arrogant about winning, something that probably comes more from years of repetition than it does raw talent- I just stop caring about those people. The silver and bronze winners seemed content and nice, I don't see why she couldn't be the same.

And she won silver in Athens, not gold.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 3:24am

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The FE

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Atom wrote:

And she won silver in Athens, not gold.
Really? I could have sworn they said she won gold back in 04. Oh well my bad.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 4:17am

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Limey

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I think the gymnast chicks are pretty hot but the rest are iffy.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 6:53am

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Aculag

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I'm not terribly concerned with the Olympics, but I heard the opening ceremony was pretty spectacular. Shame I can't find a video of it anywhere for some reason...
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 7:01am

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Serpent

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Some of the Chinese gymnasts are clearly under 16. I know it's a huge dispute, and I think they are clearly breaking the rules.

I watch gymnastics because my sister watches it, then soccer and table tennis.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 7:31am

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Atom

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Not to bring the current socio-political climate of China into this thread, but seeing some of their presentation I can't help but think, jokingly of course, "they've got a gun to their backs doing/saying _____" or "they're paying those dancers 12 cents per hour."

Maybe that's incredibly offensive of me to think, but this whole Olympics gives me such a nasty feeling that it's all a big facade- a feeling I haven't gotten from past years of Olympics. And I can't help but wonder why.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 9:01am

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Simon K Jones

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Atom wrote:

Maybe that's incredibly offensive of me to think, but this whole Olympics gives me such a nasty feeling that it's all a big facade- a feeling I haven't gotten from past years of Olympics. And I can't help but wonder why.
I know what you mean. I think what saddens me is that the Olympics really shows the potential of China - both the country itself and its people - if only the government would mature a bit.

I think - hope - that it's inevitable now, with the rise of communications and information, and China's inexorable move towards capitalism, that the government will have to improve its human rights record and freedoms. With luck the Olympics will have opened up the country a little bit more to the wider world, making it ever harder for the government to keep such an iron grip.

As for the Olympics...I've only watched the crazy uphill women's cycling, which made me feel exhausted just by watching it. smile Seriously impressive, especially the poor Chinese competitor who skidded off the road and into a ditch, with her bike landing on top of her, yet scrambled out and carried on.

Plus a Brit won, so that was cool. razz
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 12:25pm

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Aculag

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I agree, Atom. For some reason, in my head I keep comparing these Olympics to the 1936 games in Nazi Berlin. Might be awful to think, but I as well get a really weird feeling about it.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 12:37pm

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Frosty G

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Yeah all the Chinese men banging on those drums all together and then the karate thing during the Opening ceremonies creeped me out.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 12:39pm

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Simon K Jones

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Frosty G wrote:

Yeah all the Chinese men banging on those drums all together and then the karate thing during the Opening ceremonies creeped me out.
Why?
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 12:51pm

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Arktic

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Don't you see, Tarn?!

Drumming and Karate are metaphors for COMMUNISM.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 1:09pm

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drspin98

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You would be hard pressed to find a bigger fan of the Olympics than myself. I could go on and on. But one thing that to me makes a huge statement is looking at the Chinese uniforms. Here they are IN China (a pretty populous place from what I hear), competing FOR China and their uniforms spells "China" in ENGLISH!!?! It does not even have the Chinese characters below or above the English.

I have drawn my own judgement on that-I'll let you drawn up your own. Could you imagine the Olympics in Chicago and the U.S team having their uniforms say "United States" in Japanese, or Chinese, or...?
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 1:33pm

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Xcession

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Last time I checked the score boards, China had already got 6 golds, the nearest other country having just 3. China aren't usually significant winners at the Olympics, so to suddenly be 1st and several medals clear of the 2nd place? - thats just a bit odd!

Apparently China have thrown huge sums of money at their sports facilities to ensure their competitors have the best chance of winning. Naturally its what any hosting country would do, but in a communist state you can't help but wonder who/what they took that money away from. If they happily bulldozed hundreds of occupied houses to make way for the olympic village, what did they do to procure that training money?

The stereotypical view of anyone whos is good at something and Chinese, is that they must have had a gun held to their head throughout childhood, but when so much money has been disporportionately ploughed into their sportsmen/women, someone somewhere will surely be under a lot of pressure to see achievements!
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 9:22pm

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rogolo

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drspin98 wrote:

Could you imagine the Olympics in Chicago
Huzzah for having the 2016 games in Chicago (hopefully)

Chicago2016.org

Frosty G wrote:

Yeah all the Chinese men banging on those drums all together and then the karate thing during the Opening ceremonies creeped me out.
I agree - the broadcasters noted that since it seemed so intimidating, the performers were told to smile during the performance.

The Opening ceremonies were pretty sick though - the printing blocks and HUGE LED screen were amazing. Torch lighting was pretty nice too.

I recorded the whole thing in HD (33 GB!), but if there is demand, I'll cut out commercials and Parade of Nations and compress it and throw it online if anyone wants it.
Posted: Mon, 11th Aug 2008, 11:43pm

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D3L3T10N

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Tarn wrote:

if only the government would mature a bit.
Along with half their gymnastics team...

Arktic wrote:

Don't you see, Tarn?!

Drumming and Karate are metaphors for COMMUNISM.
lol
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 3:24am

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The FE

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drspin98 wrote:

Here they are IN China (a pretty populous place from what I hear), competing FOR China and their uniforms spells "China" in ENGLISH!!?! It does not even have the Chinese characters below or above the English.
Well English is the the most commonly spoken language in the world isnt it? So wouldnt it make sense to write the name of the country in the language that would be most widely understood? Has it been written in Mandarin in past Olympics?
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 6:18am

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FreshMentos

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I just watched a rerun of the men's 400 meter freestyle relay because I missed the initial showing. My god, that has got to be the most amazing thing I've ever witnessed in an Olympic event. France was at least a full body length ahead of the U.S. and on the last 50 meters the U.S. pulled out in front of France and beat them by approximately 8 milliseconds. I'm still in shock and awe.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 6:40am

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Atom

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Frosty G wrote:

Yeah all the Chinese men banging on those drums all together and then the karate thing during the Opening ceremonies creeped me out.
I think, perhaps, he means the China-centrism in what is normally (well, at least from the past 6-7 Olympics I've seen) a pretty 'worldly' event of an opening. Don't get me wrong, it was incredibly cool and entertaining- but not what or how the Olympics opening normally is.

Normally it's very varied, lots of different bits with several country-specific/famous showcases and ethnicities. This time, it just wasn't the same.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 11:10am

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drspin98

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FE Filmmaker wrote:

drspin98 wrote:

Here they are IN China (a pretty populous place from what I hear), competing FOR China and their uniforms spells "China" in ENGLISH!!?! It does not even have the Chinese characters below or above the English.
Well English is the the most commonly spoken language in the world isnt it? So wouldnt it make sense to write the name of the country in the language that would be most widely understood? Has it been written in Mandarin in past Olympics?
If that is the extent of the connection you wish to make out of that fact...all righty then.

Last edited Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 11:18am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 11:15am

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Hybrid-Halo

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Watched the opening ceremony on the BBC's iPlayer a couple of days ago. Brought a tear to my eye, the lighting of the torch was glorious.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 12:19pm

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Simon K Jones

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drspin98 wrote:

FE Filmmaker wrote:

drspin98 wrote:

Here they are IN China (a pretty populous place from what I hear), competing FOR China and their uniforms spells "China" in ENGLISH!!?! It does not even have the Chinese characters below or above the English.
Well English is the the most commonly spoken language in the world isnt it? So wouldnt it make sense to write the name of the country in the language that would be most widely understood? Has it been written in Mandarin in past Olympics?
If that is the extent of the connection you wish to make out of that fact...all righty then.
I think it was aliens.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 3:06pm

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No Respite Productions

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Those of you in awe at the opening ceremony might be interested in this article...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/olympics/article-1043857/Viewers-conned-fake-footage-opening-ceremony-Beijing-Olympic-Games.html

I don't suppose any FX Homers were working on this were they? smile

Apologies for the Daily Mail link, I despise this as a newspaper, it has also been reported on the BBC but they've focused more on the fact that the little girl was miming!
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 3:11pm

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Frosty G

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rogolo wrote:


Frosty G wrote:

Yeah all the Chinese men banging on those drums all together and then the karate thing during the Opening ceremonies creeped me out.
I agree - the broadcasters noted that since it seemed so intimidating, the performers were told to smile during the performance.
Yep, it was intimidating. I mean, they explained throughout the event that they had to insert bright colors and tell the performers to smile because it was too intimidating.

I didn't find it creepy that they were banging drums and doing karate solely for those reasons. Both seemed to be important to Chinese culture, but the sheer number of performers doing it in unison. It puts that 1 billion population number into perspective.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 3:15pm

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Simon K Jones

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No Respite Productions wrote:

Those of you in awe at the opening ceremony might be interested in this article...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/olympics/article-1043857/Viewers-conned-fake-footage-opening-ceremony-Beijing-Olympic-Games.html

I don't suppose any FX Homers were working on this were they? smile
How very bizarre! Rather undermines the entire point of 'live' television...the miming doesn't surprise me at all, but using actual CG shots is just cheeky.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 3:32pm

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Xcession

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Miming wouldn't surprise me if the mimer was the person who was singing the recorded version - Top Of The Pops got away with that for decades. But having someone unrelated, miming another person's vocals is just outright deception.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 3:54pm

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Pooky

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The footprint fireworks did, indeed, happen though. They just showed prerecorded footage in case they had trouble filming the real thing. It would also have been too dangerous to film fireworks from a helicopter.
Posted: Tue, 12th Aug 2008, 4:27pm

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Frosty G

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Pooky wrote:

The footprint fireworks did, indeed, happen though. They just showed prerecorded footage in case they had trouble filming the real thing. It would also have been too dangerous to film fireworks from a helicopter.
I thought that looked a bit fake...
Posted: Wed, 13th Aug 2008, 9:56pm

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Atom

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Pooky wrote:

The footprint fireworks did, indeed, happen though. They just showed prerecorded footage in case they had trouble filming the real thing. It would also have been too dangerous to film fireworks from a helicopter.
Actually, it appears now portions of it were CG altogether, not even prerecorded. Oh, and now word also comes out that the singer for the Chinese national anthem lipsynced it and wasn't really the singer that was supposed to be up there. (like, I dunno, having a Britney Spears song lipsynced by Jessica Simpson. heh)

China's missing it on all marks for me to give them any credit this Olympics. I can't help but feel a little disgusted when I see what, to me, are clearly 9 to 11-year-olds doing the 16+ Olympic stuff; and I think that's just a minor part of the smoke and mirrors game they're running this year. I mean, am I crazy?

The teens on Team USA look young, sure, but they also look passably 16. China's team?

Not a chance- right?
Posted: Wed, 13th Aug 2008, 10:37pm

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Pooky

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Maybe Chinese teens look younger than Caucasian teens. But, yeah, I said prerecorded and meant premade... as I said, it would have been too dangerous to have a chopper in the air at the same time as fireworks.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 6:43am

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Atom

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Pooky wrote:

Maybe Chinese teens look younger than Caucasian teens. But, yeah, I said prerecorded and meant premade... as I said, it would have been too dangerous to have a chopper in the air at the same time as fireworks.
I was using Team USA (perhaps not properly because in this area of athleticism it is all Caucasian) as an example because we have a number of races in our Olympic teams, and they all- to some extent- look passably the ages necessary for each sport.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 7:22am

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Serpent

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Several other Chinese female gymnasts look 16 passable. It's that one girl Atom just posted that just clearly isn't. Honestly isn't a big deal to me though, more power to her if she is beating 16-year-old gymnasts.

I think these Olympics are fine. Only thing that bothers me is that with a 10 year bid on the Olympics, China didn't clean up the horrible pollution that is effecting athletes.

Spain vs. China basketball was awesome. I fastforwarded through it as I hate basketball, but toward the end Spain made a huge come back to tie it up and won it in overtime.

The only other thing I've watched is USA vs. New Zeland women's soccer, where we demolished; as well as Brazil vs. Nigeria with 3 awesome goals by Christiane for Brazil. I'm only interested in the big soccer games, and table tennis. I'll also watch the men's tennis finals. Hell, I might watch more stuff, this is the most interested I've ever been in the Olympics actually. smile
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 7:56am

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Arktic

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I'd just like to say that I think everyone (at least, everyone in the media) seems to be jumping in and using the Olympics to have a go at China.

I mean - so what if that kid mimed? If it happened in any other country, there wouldn't be a word said about it. Who cares if the fireworks were CG? I think they looked great, and surely *that* is the point of the Olympic opening ceremony, not the methods they've used (as long as they haven't done anything illegal)? Or they're employing people to fill up any empty seats in the less well attended events - what does that matter? I think that's actually a bloody good idea, as it'll help the athletes perform better, and it gives a nicer look on television.

Or the fact that an ITN journalist was 'pushed' a bit and arrested whilst reporting on a demonstration outside the stadium? That is what happens at public protests! Innocent people sometimes get pulled in for questioning; and as the reporter himself said, there was some pushing and shoving, but no hitting. To me, that sounds like very responsible policing! There's far worse things happening in hundreds of countries throughout the world - you just have to look at some of the police actions in the recent UK protests over that power station in Kent.

But because it's in China... suddenly it's some proof that the government is EVIL. None of these stories would have got any column inches if it had been any other country - or if it hadn't been the Olympics.

None of these things really amount to very much. If people want to get all foamy about something, then they should look at the REAL human rights abuses that happen day in, day out throughout the country: no freedom of speech, no freedom of the press, no freedom of religion/the Tibet situation - THESE are issues that we should all be worrying about, not whether some fireworks were CG, or some little girl was miming.

Cheers,
Arktic.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 8:31am

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Simon K Jones

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Arktic wrote:

I mean - so what if that kid mimed? If it happened in any other country, there wouldn't be a word said about it.
Er, yes it would. What's happened to Ethical Arktic? Personally I don't like to see children manipulated in this fashion. If it was the same singer miming on the day to her own recorded song, fine. But switching the kid, especially for the reason that she wasn't pretty enough - to me that's unacceptable. As well as being unfair to both kids, it also sends out an absolutely appalling message to other kids.

Who cares if the fireworks were CG? I think they looked great, and surely *that* is the point of the Olympic opening ceremony, not the methods they've used (as long as they haven't done anything illegal)?
Eh? OK, well let's just pre-record the entire thing, get actors in to play the athletes, do some CG doubles to make the gymnastics look better, get some wirework in on the boxing and judo.

A live sporting event should be live and untouched. Otherwise, what's the point? The specific excitement about such events is that it's LIVE, and ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN.

Or they're employing people to fill up any empty seats in the less well attended events - what does that matter? I think that's actually a bloody good idea, as it'll help the athletes perform better, and it gives a nicer look on television.
Yeah, agreed. That was a sensible idea, and I don't think anybody's really criticised it, have they?

None of these stories would have got any column inches if it had been any other country - or if it hadn't been the Olympics.
I'm pretty sure you're wrong there. Look at all the controversy in the UK last year over TV shows 'faking' things - and those shows weren't even supposed to be live.

If people want to get all foamy about something, then they should look at the REAL human rights abuses that happen day in, day out throughout the country
Just because there are much bigger problems going on elsewhere it doesn't mean you should ignore the smaller problems.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 8:43am

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Xcession

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If people want to get all foamy about something, then they should look at the REAL human rights abuses that happen day in, day out throughout the country
I think the very fact that people are getting foamy about small things in the ceremony is proof that people are generally scrutinising China heavily and constantly. That can only be a good thing.

You see a unduly pedantic and critical press - I see a watchful press, eager to publicly humiliate China for yet another breach of rights.

Outside China, 99% of the world can do nothing to address China's "real" issues, except through protest highlighting the problems, calling on everyone else to pay attention and generally putting China in a permanently awkward position. Is that not what this coverage of the 'faking' is doing?

Its not exactly UN sanctions, but its doing a vital job in showing China that everyone is watching everything.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 8:49am

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Atom

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Thank. You. Tarn. And. Xcession.

I don't have a problem with China, and normally I wouldn't just take attack at a government or country. But this is the Olympics, a time when all the countries compete in a friendly manner and unity and glory are big. I'd judge each country no matter where it was held. Even if that place was here in Dallas. (which was an early candidate for this Olympics like 10 years ago smile)

No one can help criticizing something if there's repeated areas of fishiness that all come from one place- especially when that place happens to be a fishy, freedom-restrictive communism to begin with. smile
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 9:25am

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Arktic

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Tarn wrote:

But switching the kid, especially for the reason that she wasn't pretty enough - to me that's unacceptable. As well as being unfair to both kids, it also sends out an absolutely appalling message to other kids.
I don't really see as all that different to the following scenario - everyone knows that the kids in "High School Musical" are pitch shifted and voice corrected to high heaven. They've not been chosen for their vocal abilities (for the most part). They've been chosen because they have the right look. But why didn't the director choose other, more talented singers, who might not look as 'All-American' or pretty? Is that not the wrong message to send out to kids?

Tarn wrote:

let's just pre-record the entire thing, get actors in to play the athletes, do some CG doubles to make the gymnastics look better, get some wirework in on the boxing and judo.
The opening ceremony isn't a sporting event, you know. There's no competition. What you're talking about is faking the competition. That would be an unethical scenario. But the ceremony is just there to look spectacular - and why shouldn't we use technology to augment it, if it's possible (and quite possibly safer) to do so? To my mind, the opening ceremony is pure theatre, not athletic competition.

Xcession wrote:

You see a unduly pedantic and critical press - I see a watchful press, eager to publicly humiliate China for yet another breach of rights.
I disagree. I see a press driven by a public desire to feel as though they're contributing something to the effort to make China more ethical, whereas really none of this stuff matters, at the end of the day. It's something to make the public better - let's all marvel at how backwards and evil China is - but it doesn't actually achieve squat.

Xcession wrote:

Outside China, 99% of the world can do nothing to address China's "real" issues, except through protest highlighting the problems, calling on everyone else to pay attention and generally putting China in a permanently awkward position. Is that not what this coverage of the 'faking' is doing?
And reading the paper or watching the news really doesn't constitute a protest, to my mind. These people who are up in arms that a little girl mimed should, in my opinion, join Amnesty International and actually MAKE a change. When was the last time any of you in this thread actually attended a pro-Tibet rally? I'd wager that most of you, though happy to be armchair critics, haven't really paid much thought to it beyond a casual conversation down the pub. Of course, I could very well be wrong, but I get the feeling that most of the people happy to criticise China for it's 'faked' Olympic opening ceremony don't actually care to do anything that will make a difference.

Cheers,
Arktic.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 9:38am

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Xcession

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Reading papers or watching the news aren't instantly positive acts of protest, sure, but just because people aren't immediately spurred into far-left activism doesn't mean they won't think about it ever again.

Whether i've physically taken part in a pro-Tibet rally is really quite irrelevant. Its certainly one of the most ostensibly active things you can do to promote a cause, but I can still donate online, I can still enthuse my feelings to my friends, I can still boycott and I can still affect behavioural change simply through having learnt about it and passing it on to others. Rallies work, but so does viral information.

Whether the press are merely paying lipservice to Chinas ethical issues is unimportant: raising awareness of the problem at all, is going to be sufficient for the world at large to become more aware of China in general. Just because you've read every pamphlet, marched every rally, foamed in every coffee house and protested outside every take-away doesn't mean that other people are equally as knowledgeable about the problems.

If its not quite the quality of activism you are personally after, then thats your own fight, but in the same way that Any Publicity Is Good Publicity, in the Chinese situation Any Publicity Raises Awareness, and I'd love to hear you say thats a bad idea.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 10:06am

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Atom

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You don't have to be in a crowd at a protest to see something as wrong, let alone voice it, Arktic. That's just silly. I've been to rallies for things I believe in, protests for things I'm against, but it's ridiculous to say you can't talk about something without taking immediate action yourself.

Surely, you know that. Also, another dead-on post from Xcession.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 10:35am

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Arktic

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That's not what I'm saying at all though, Atom. I never said you had to take action to know that something is wrong.

What I am saying is that whilst people are willing to pay attention to these things that are quite insignificant, very few people are willing to pay attention, much less take action, against the things that DO matter.

Xcession - yes, focusing international attention on China is a good idea; but by diluting the public conscious and press coverage with all this nonsense about whether the fireworks were fake or not, it detracts from the real issues. The press is using the Olympics as a way to take a pop at all these non-issues, which by the same token means that we're not paying attention to the real problems.

Cheers,
Arktic.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 10:40am

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Hybrid-Halo

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I'm of the opinion that by paying any attention to China's governmental issues with Tibet we're being distracted from human rights issues closer to home. I'm all for making the world a better place, though I think a look at our priorities is in order first.

I also don't generally think China give two damns that the world is watching. They've effectively shielded their entire population from the negative coverage of the entire issue - including everything regarding demonstrations of the torch's journey. Protests aren't really doing anything beneficial.

Sooner or later, China will need the rest of the world so that it can continue to grow. I think that simply acknowledging the issues with their country now will provide us with leeway to make demands when that time comes. No need to get all flibbly flobbly over it. How about we stop shipping people off to other countries so they can be tortured first hey?

-Hybrid
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 11:05am

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Simon K Jones

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Arktic wrote:

Tarn wrote:

But switching the kid, especially for the reason that she wasn't pretty enough - to me that's unacceptable. As well as being unfair to both kids, it also sends out an absolutely appalling message to other kids.
I don't really see as all that different to the following scenario - everyone knows that the kids in "High School Musical" are pitch shifted and voice corrected to high heaven. They've not been chosen for their vocal abilities (for the most part). They've been chosen because they have the right look. But why didn't the director choose other, more talented singers, who might not look as 'All-American' or pretty? Is that not the wrong message to send out to kids?
Yeah, it is. But at least the voices are the kid's voices, albeit enhanced. But also, High School Musical is fiction and is not live, so is quite a different situation. If they'd dubbed the pretty kids' voices with other singers, then that'd be different.

I mean, have you not watched Singin' in the Rain??? razz

But the ceremony is just there to look spectacular - and why shouldn't we use technology to augment it, if it's possible (and quite possibly safer) to do so? To my mind, the opening ceremony is pure theatre, not athletic competition.
OK, so why bother doing it live at all? Given that 99% of the viewers will be watching it on TV, rather than on location, why not just make the whole thing fiction? Then it'll be REALLY cool. You could put spaceships and aliens and stuff in it. And lightsabers.

Weeee.

Xcession wrote:

You see a unduly pedantic and critical press - I see a watchful press, eager to publicly humiliate China for yet another breach of rights.
I disagree. I see a press driven by a public desire to feel as though they're contributing something to the effort to make China more ethical
I see what you're getting at, but I really disagree with your "all or nothing" attitude. In fact, it's really quite unhealthy and unrealistic. People will always react in different ways, and you kinda need all of those different ways. You'll have the extremist activists that blow shit up, you'll have the peaceful protesters, you'll have the internet bloggers, people that donate money, people that go down the pub and discuss it. They all help in their own ways - sure, some more than others, perhaps, but you shouldn't belittle people just because they're not willing to grab a placard and get out on the street.

Don't forget there are lots of kids watching the Olympics - if they grow up with an awareness of this kind of thing, it can only help to filter through into future diplomatic relations and general media awareness.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 11:39am

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Arktic

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Tarn wrote:

Yeah, it is. But at least the voices are the kid's voices, albeit enhanced. But also, High School Musical is fiction and is not live, so is quite a different situation. If they'd dubbed the pretty kids' voices with other singers, then that'd be different.
Not true - Zac Efron (the male lead) doesn't actually sing the majority of his lines. A second, unseen, actor does. And those lines that are done by Efron, are so utterly auto-tuned that they belie the fact that he can't sing, and was only picked because he is really cute.

And though the movies are, yes, not live - the live tours and concerts ARE (supposedly). And again, though the actors aren't being dubbed with anyone else's voices as far as we know, they are all on live auto-tune devices to ensure that their 'live' performances are perfectly flawless every time.

So does that make Disney an evil corporation? Or is replacing the voice of a good-looking performer with a different voice or a dramatically enhanced voice actually just part of show business and theatre?

And again I stand by the assertion that the opening ceremony isn't an athletic competition, or even 'factual', but merely theatrical performance. Part of the point of theatre is that it IS a mostly live performance - but that doesn't mean you shouldn't include some digital enhancements, does it?

I mean if we were to apply your logic - that if you enhance some of a performance you might as well enhance ALL the performance - then I guess Axis of Evil Productions will stop doing live shows at the Playhouse, and just make movies instead? razz

Tarn wrote:

I see what you're getting at, but I really disagree with your "all or nothing" attitude.
I don't neccesarily think it's an 'all or nothing' attitude - more of a 'do-something-worthwhile-rather-than-foaming or nothing" attitude wink
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 11:41am

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Xcession

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I don't neccesarily think it's an 'all or nothing' attitude - more of a 'do-something-worthwhile-rather-than-foaming or nothing" attitude
You see the irony there, don't you? What could you have achieved in the last 2 hours while you've been arguing your point on a forum?
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 11:46am

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Arktic

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Sadly I'm at work at the moment - and repling to posts inbetween renders. So I can't really dash out of the office every half hour to go and protest. Nor would I really want to, as a matter of fact.

However, as a supporter of Amnesty, some of the money I earn today will go towards making the world a better place.

And you must agree - that is worthwhile, isn't it?
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 11:48am

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Xcession

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The message is, basically, "every little helps" </bob hoskins>, right?

You couldn't go protest, but you're funding an organisation that does. I couldn't go protest, but i'm spreading the word to more people.


... and why? because we saw it in the media, someone created a forum post about it and are now all the participants of this thread are more inspired.

Thats some effective media coverage, if you ask me!
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 1:23pm

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drspin98

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:



I also don't generally think China give two damns that the world is watching.


One of two things here-either I somehow do not understand the context of this quote or you have not been watching anything (starting at least 6 months ago) dealing with this Olympics


BTW Kinda funny- http://www.borowitzreport.com/
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 1:39pm

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Pooky

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Xcession wrote:

The message is, basically, "every little helps" </bob hoskins>, right?

You couldn't go protest, but you're funding an organisation that does. I couldn't go protest, but i'm spreading the word to more people.


... and why? because we saw it in the media, someone created a forum post about it and are now all the participants of this thread are more inspired.

Thats some effective media coverage, if you ask me!
Isn't that the point, though? With so much power, the media should direct it at something that matters! Children being dubbed and fireworks being faked aren't as life-changing as famines, wars, torture and spying; they're just more interesting to read about, these days.
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 3:18pm

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No Respite Productions

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Hang the on, there has been zero on the news recently with regards to the Olympics thanks to Russia's little stint in Georgia, so to say that the media isn't directing it's effort into something that matters is kind of incorrect. Oh and plenty of coverage with Zimbabwe too.

You show a live ceremony, you show a live ceremony. Adding CG into what was supposed to be a live event is actually quite symptomatic of the levels of deceit that China will go to, and that's what the press have picked upon and torn to pieces. The people in China put up with distorted media on a daily basis, now the whole world has had a taste of what China will do to assert it's dominance.

The message from many on this occasion is that it's not acceptable to essentially fob off the world with false images during a "live" broadcast.

As an aside I'm not anti-Chinese, anti-communist, anti-anything. But there is nothing wrong with the sharing of information to other people, after all knowledge is power and that is one of the good things that the internet has given all people who access it...

... oh, except the Chinese

redface
Posted: Thu, 14th Aug 2008, 9:58pm

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D3L3T10N

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Jon Steward and The Daily Show's take:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/30710/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-wed-aug-13-2008?c=159:279
Posted: Fri, 15th Aug 2008, 8:49am

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CX3

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Is it just me or the west coast (or world wide)? -- but has the feed been going out a lot during the olympics? We were watching about 30-40 mins ago and Shawn Johnson had just finished and was waiting on her score and as soon as they were about to post it, the feed went out completely and stayed out. All other channels worked fine, no problems.


Whether its a world wide or a west coast issue, NBC is dropping the ball hard. And I'm sure they'll hear about it.

EDIT: Also, I think it's bs that the west coast doesn't get a live feed as most everywhere else in the world does. NBC is just milking the commercials, ads and ratings. It's the dumbest thing ever. Everyone on the west coast has to literally avoid all tv (and internet) interaction until primetime hits so we can avoid being spoiled by the outcomes. I'm about to drive down to the NBC/Universal real quick and throw a couple of rocks through their windows.

Buncha cash cows... disgust

Last edited Sun, 17th Aug 2008, 3:53am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Sun, 17th Aug 2008, 12:39am

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petet2

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Sorry to lower the tone guys but my favourite Olympic comedy moments so far were:

the Women's Diving - how did the commentators keep going without even a chortle each time they introduced the German diver Katya Dickov

and the Men's 20k Walk when Jared Tallent of Australia projectile vomited as he crossed then line then fell to his knees and had another "I'm a firing my laser" moment all over the track. I want to see the picture he has on his mantlepiece by his bronze medal "here's me crossing the line"!
Posted: Sun, 17th Aug 2008, 3:16am

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Bolbi

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MICHEAL PHELPS. #8 WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted: Sun, 17th Aug 2008, 3:52am

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CX3

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Bolbi wrote:

MICHEAL PHELPS. #8 WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
See what I'm talkin about...?

F NBC
Posted: Mon, 18th Aug 2008, 1:43pm

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Hybrid-Halo

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drspin98 wrote:

Hybrid-Halo wrote:



I also don't generally think China give two damns that the world is watching.


One of two things here-either I somehow do not understand the context of this quote or you have not been watching anything (starting at least 6 months ago) dealing with this Olympics
There's a slight difference between China making an effort to dazzle the world with the Olympics as a gesture of power and accomplishment, and China changing their stance on Tibet. Roughing up of reporters and continued police beatings of protesters for example.

As much coverage the Tibet issue is receiving world-wide, you have to remember that China has shielded it's citizens from this coverage. Slightly scary that they are capable of doing this.

-Matt