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2012 Trailer

Posted: Thu, 18th Jun 2009, 10:07pm

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jawajohnny

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http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1810045661/video/14045555

Wow. eek
Posted: Thu, 18th Jun 2009, 10:31pm

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doppelganger

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eh... atleast its got John Cusack
Posted: Thu, 18th Jun 2009, 10:41pm

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Garrison

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I was better off with just knowing the teaser.
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 12:26am

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TheOutlawAmbulance

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12/21/12......Spooky. Wow! I don't think that the end will be on 12/21/12. But just incase............what time zone is GMT?
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 9:19am

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Simon K Jones

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Hehehehehe, brilliant.

Its like Megashark Versus Giant Octopus, but someone accidentally gave it a massive budget.

I declare now that this will be the best film of the year.
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 10:28am

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Pretty cool trailer. I never much cared for Emmerich movies (except Independence Day which I thought was the coolest thing ever when I was 12 years old), but I'll see this just because Chiwetel Ejiofor is that cool.

Tarn wrote:

I declare now that this will be the best film of the year.
Avatar anyone?

Avatar will be the best film ever made. Ever. Only film that can top Avatar is Star Wars (1977).
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 3:29pm

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Pooky

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Rating: +1

Oh god, after the Ubisoft E3 conference, I feel like I've already watched Avatar fifteen times.
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 3:56pm

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ben3308

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This looks 1,000,000 times better than I expected it would. Like the perfect fusion of the epic-ness of 'The Patriot' with the impending doom of 'Independence Day'.

I think Emmerich is back. wink
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 4:03pm

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videofxuniverse

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It really does look like an epic film with lots of destruction and things being destroyed which is always amazing in films. I wonder what caused it all? Probably to do with those castaways on THAT island who couldnt be bothered to type in those numbers anymore.
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 4:04pm

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jawajohnny

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Staff Only wrote:

Avatar anyone?

Avatar will be the best film ever made. Ever. Only film that can top Avatar is Star Wars (1977).
Why is everyone saying Avatar's going to be the best movie of the year? We haven't even seen a frame from it yet. Sure the special effects and 3D technology will probably be out of this world... but will the story deliver? Will it actually be a good movie? My concern is that there won't be enough theaters with 3D projectors, so will seeing it in 2D suppress my overall opinion of it?

ben3308 wrote:

This looks 1,000,000 times better than I expected it would. Like the perfect fusion of the epic-ness of 'The Patriot' with the impending doom of 'Independence Day'.

I think Emmerich is back. wink
Exactly. I really wasn't expecting much from it, and the teaser trailer didn't do anything for me. I was actually planning on skipping it, but now I'm definitely going to see it, if only for the epic destruction effects, and Chiwetel Ejiofor.
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 4:31pm

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Simon K Jones

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Understand that when I say 'best', I don't mean in terms of artistic merit.

I mean in terms of ridiculous hilarity and unrestrained madness.
Posted: Fri, 19th Jun 2009, 5:22pm

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jawajohnny wrote:

Why is everyone saying Avatar's going to be the best movie of the year? We haven't even seen a frame from it yet.
There's no need to. Not if we can believe one word Cameron has said to us. (And we can because he's James Cameron.)

Check this out.

And take note of such things as that we have heard from respected directors that watching Avatar is like dreaming, not watching a screen. Cameron has said the end battle will be the mother of all battles, of all action scenes. The biggest action scene ever was at the end of Pirates 3. I say that if he can beat that in scope and technical achievement (which he can because, once again, he's James Cameron for cryin' out loud) we have a winner already.

jawajohnny wrote:

My concern is that there won't be enough theaters with 3D projectors, so will seeing it in 2D suppress my overall opinion of it?

For the sake of being just a little bit objective (for once) I will admit this has me a little worried. Also I am slightly worried that even if it's very good (which judging by the director it will be razz), it might do a Shawshank or Watchmen and not click with the people initially. I, of course, hope it does like Star Wars or The Matrix and flies right into our open loving arms, but the premise of film is a gamble. It could go either way.

Tarn wrote:

Understand that when I say 'best', I don't mean in terms of artistic merit.

I mean in terms of ridiculous hilarity and unrestrained madness.
I wasn't really accusing you of seriously saying an Emmerich pic will be the best film ever, but my response that Avatar will be the best was completely on the level. I seriously believe that. Even if I believe no film ever can beat Star Wars, if there is one: it's Avatar.
Posted: Sat, 20th Jun 2009, 3:47am

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Aculag

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Looks like your pretty standard over-the-top CG fest blockbuster schlock! What a shock.

12212012
Posted: Sun, 21st Jun 2009, 2:19am

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TheOutlawAmbulance

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Tarn wrote:

I declare now that this will be the best film of the year.
I 100% agree with you there. This movie looks top-notch!
Posted: Sun, 21st Jun 2009, 4:40am

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Atom

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Staff Only wrote:

jawajohnny wrote:

Why is everyone saying Avatar's going to be the best movie of the year? We haven't even seen a frame from it yet.
There's no need to. Not if we can believe one word Cameron has said to us. (And we can because he's James Cameron.)

Check this out.
This is easily one of the most wildly unsubstantiated dick-sucking articles I've ever read. When the least prideful quotes in it from JC are stuff like
Avatar is the single most complex piece of filmmaking ever made.
you know you're getting a bias of some kind. I've yet to see anything decent that makes me genuinely excited about this movie. Yeah, it's fine for everyone to bash the 'uncanny valley' of CGI humans; but when James Cameron is doing it- it's not only alright, it's have-an-aneurysm-you're-so-excited ridiculous.

Sure, maybe Avatar will be a great movie. Maybe not. It all, entirely entirely entirely, remains to be seen. I mean, I like James Cameron and all, but come on. Other gifted directors have made equally-as-good movies if not better than his in the time it's taken him to pull together one. This isn't to say that the likes of T2 and Titanic aren't excellent movies- but they are far from the greatest movies ever made- especially considering a movie set I don't even like, LOTR, can be orchestrated on such an epic scale in such a smaller amount of time- and likely be a better movie than this 'Avatar', and still not get the same overwhelming, overhyped Christ-like credit Cameron gets. Not even one solid image has been released from the actual film- and we're at this?

Give me a f*cking break, it's embarrassing how ridiculous the reaction to such nothingness is.
Posted: Sun, 21st Jun 2009, 6:19am

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Pooky

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God, Atom, you're such a hater. wink
Posted: Sun, 21st Jun 2009, 5:23pm

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No Respite Productions

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I'm with Atom on this and his opinions of that Total Film article. They just made a load of unsubstantiated statements and assumptions based on very vague soundbites. Not cool!

I'm very interested with Avatar because I just can't picture in my head what the film is going to look like. It seems to be this thing steeped in myth and mystery. Looking forward to proper screenshots and trailers but lets not pretend Cameron = Excellence. Titanic was an absolute pile of arse and he has some making up to do!

Back on track, 2012 looks like every other Roland Emmerich film ever made, I don't even need to go see the damned thing because I reckon I could map the whole thing out pretty well in my head based on his past form.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 8:21am

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Simon K Jones

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T1, T2 and The Abyss are the only things I particularly like by Cameron, and they were a long time ago, so I don't tend to bow does at his altar like some people do.

Having said that, I'm very excited about Avatar from a filmmaking point of view, based on what I've been told about the technique. It sounds fascinating.

In terms of 'beating' the 'epic battle' at the end of PotC3, it really isn't that difficult. All you need to do is give the audience something to actually care about.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 11:12am

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Tarn wrote:

In terms of 'beating' the 'epic battle' at the end of PotC3, it really isn't that difficult. All you need to do is give the audience something to actually care about.

Warning: Long, obsessive, boring, of topic rant that makes absolutely no reference to 2012. (Sorry guys, I had to get this off my chest neutral)

Hehe, why do I get the feeling I was the only guy in the theater actually caring that John Knoll and ILM only had 4 months post on PotC3, and therefore made vfx history by having the entire vfx house [ILM] working on the same project at once for the first time since Return of the Jedi. Or:

John Knoll wrote:

ILM's record computing power on At World's End: "Every evening we used about 70,000 processor hours -- the equivalent of one processor running for about eight years. And so for the entire production, I'm estimating that we used one processor millennium and that's just at ILM. This represents the biggest disc space footprint of any show at ILM: 103 terabytes -- a new record for us. Up until February, the entire company was 75 terabytes, so we had to expand the storage pool considerably. We ended up using about 130% of ILM's previous disc space just for [this] Pirates."
If Avatar is beating that I assure you I will be quite happy with the film no matter the story, characters...etc. Like I said in the Transformers thread: when I go to see Avatar, I go to see technical achievements. I remember saying earlier that Pirates 3 was one of my best movie going experiences, and I remember thinking I'd seen the beauty of the universe when the camera went over the maelstrom and showed us the center.

Not to say that I don't really hope that the characters, plot, and most of all score (I would mention direction, cinematography etc. but even you Atom must admit that Cameron never get's those things wrong?) are all top notch because then Cameron might have finally done the impossible and come close to making a film as relevant as Star Wars. In terms of changing cinema for ever, and lingering in pop-culture for ever and ever, and most of all making pure concentrated film-magic no film has touched Star Wars, and the reason I am more psyched for Avatar than for any film I've ever waited for, is because someone [Cameron] has possibly finally done it.

Also if you've looked at Cameron's career and heard him speak of Star Wars [He says when he saw it, the first thing he thought was: "Damn it! Someone did it already!", then he proceeded to quit his job and get back into filmmaking.] it would seem he (as me) thinks Star Wars is the biggest most important film ever, and has been trying to beat it. If he manages it would really inspire me because it means that nothing is impossible with the right will-power. A lot of artistic achievements seem to be up to destiny and inspiration (an idea coming into your head out of nowhere [incidentally and idea out of nowhere was the basis for Cameron's: The Terminator]), but if you set out to make history before you have an idea it seems you are doomed to fail.

Lucas, Da Vinci, Mozart wern't trying to get into the history books, but they did. Cameron on the other hand seems to be actively trying (he's already one of three directors who have swept 11 oscars) and if he does succeed it wins a big battle in the "choose your own destiny" category, so I'm rooting for Avatar like no other film.

I am, as we speak making a letter which I am sending to the Norwegian minister for culture telling him to give the money needed to build (or equip an existing theater with) an IMAX 3D Cinema before December. Tall order, but I'm doing my duty.

I've never cared for football teams or (as a devoted individualist) been interested in patriotism or, as people put it: "Something bigger than myself", but now I know what that is like. Avatar is that thing to me.

So, in closing, if Avatar turns out to be a let down of Phantom Menace proportions you will know who (apart from Cameron) is the most disappointed person in the world.

Reasons why Avatar might be a Phantom Meance:

Here's the case for the prosecution :

1) You've been away too long Jim.
Cameron doesn't have that youthful hunger for film making that he once had, that need to push himself to prove himself. George Lucas proved that a lot of rust can develop on the creative wheels when you step out of the game for more than a decade.

2) Technological Obsession:
Like Lucas did after Starwars when he abandoned film making to focus on ILM and the technical side of a production, you get the feeling that Cameron is more interested in the technology and the process of creating it than the final product.
It's a dangerous thing loose sight of the fact that the most important piece of technology a film can have is a screenwriters pen and I wonder if he's lost the ability to see the wood for the trees.

3) Middle aged spread:
Themes like environmentalism and eco-adventuring smack of the kind of self indulgent preachy middle class concerns of the comfortably well off.
Lucas and his clumsy anti corporate blather (sic) really sunk the Starwars franchise with a storyline about as subtle as a car bomb.
I'm concerned that Cameron may be more concerned with trendy causes than storytelling. A preachy moral to a story is fine if it's subtly addressed as a context that drives the plot rather than bluntly being the plot,(for example, Appocalypse Now subtly and brilliantly addresses many of this movies themes) but subtlety is not one of Cameron's strong suits. I fear being bludgeoned over the head with heavy handed moralizing and weighty speeches about eco-catastrophe that are devoid of humor, charm or relevence to the plot.

4) Clunking Ego
What's that I hear? Is it the sound of truly awful dialogue thudding to the ground? Like Lucas, Cameron's scripts are never been short of a few jarring clangers. Having evolved an ego that success has fueled, is there anybody out there capable of saying to Cameron, "you know what boss, that just doesn't work"?

5)Self Doubt.
Why is he dragging out a 10yr old scriptment from the bottom drawer? Lucas for his comeback similarly raided his past credibility for new inspiration suggesting that the creative well has run dry. Cameron's long awaited return to genre film making is welcome, but does is smack of insecurity about his ability to deliver to expectation?

6)Hush!
I understand that some film makers like to keep a project under wraps so that the audience is not jaded before it even sees the film but the level of secrecy also worries me. Could it be that, like 'ol George and his Phantom Menace, that a tightly guarded secret is as often a dirty secret as it is a pleasant surprise? Could this be the least shown yet most talked up disaster of the decade?

7)Behind the curve not ahead of it:
3D? So What? Remember when Jurassic Park debuted? My jaw dropped when I saw those CGI dinosaurs roam the plain.
3D however does not exactly have the ability to bring something as new to the movie goers experience as Cameron thinks. Avatar has been so long in production that many a film has stolen it's march and even the bloody Jonas Brothers are in on the RealD game, if they got there first what hope have we of being impressed by anything other than the monumental size of your headache after wearing stereoscopic glasses for three bloody hours! Again, gee, whiz, bang! is no substitute for coherent writing and a solid plot as Terminator: Salvation proved earlier this month.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 12:55pm

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Simon K Jones

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I guess the difference is that I consider 'scriptwriting' to be as important a technical area as cinematography or visual effects.

Sure, I can admire ILM's work in PotC3, but it's still an arse film.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 1:03pm

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Tarn wrote:

I guess the difference is that I consider 'scriptwriting' to be as important a technical area as cinematography or visual effects.

Sure, I can admire ILM's work in PotC3, but it's still an arse film.
Don't get me wrong, you are correct. I write far more often than I direct because I love writing, and writing is just as important. That's the beauty of film. George Lucas said it himself, it's he most complex artform, because it has all these aspects.

I was trying to say that I am capable of enjoying a film just as a demo reel for the VFX supervisor and VFX house involved if the VFX are that good.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 1:06pm

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Simon K Jones

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Maybe, but in that case it's essentially just an advert for the effects company. If they let me watch it for free I'd be fine, but the idea of actually paying someone to watch their showreel is absurd.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 4:23pm

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Sollthar

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I think Emmerich is back.
WHOA. That trailer looks brilliant. Like huge, big, insane, destroy-everything, mindless, fun brilliant. What Emmerich does best, when he does it.

I'm sold! Looks awesome!


George Lucas said it himself
Heh, seeing George Lucas is one of the worst writers in Hollywood. If he said so, then it surely must be true... smile
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 9:31pm

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Staff Only

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Sollthar wrote:

George Lucas said it himself
Heh, seeing George Lucas is one of the worst writers in Hollywood. If he said so, then it surely must be true... smile
I thought someone might call me out on that. razz Feel free to call me a Lucas fanboy (hey, I deserve it), but simply for revolutionizing the hero's journey into the perfect wish fulfillment in modern film with A New Hope I think George has earned a lifelong pass ticket. Phantom Menaces aside, the guy has done some magnificent work.

Also I kind of messed up the reference to his quote. He was talking about that film is: Picture, Sound, Music, and writing at the very least. No so much that writing is important, although he has said that aswell.

I also think he's a bit misunderstood because of his lack of directing actors and failure at writing natural dialogue. If you add to it that with The Prequels he made films everyone else wanted something else from it's no wonder people bash his writing. I, however, am sure he is a visionary director who had (and has) a lot of good stories in him which is half of being a good writer. Star Wars has become a problem for him. He simply does not yet find the strength to let it go, and make all those other films he envisioned. Also I think Lucas is very good at making his films however the fck he wants. I know that when I direct I have a voice in my head telling me: "The audience will not respond well to this. Change it. Now!". Lucas doesn't seem have that. Another filmmaker that does this is Joss Whedon although arguably more successfully as he is a better writer than George by far. This is another reason that such stinkers as Ewoks and Jar Jar went right into the final cut even with people such as Ben Burtt telling Geroge [about Jar Jar]: "Look man, it's too much."

I promise I won't post anymore off topic stuff in here.

About 2012: With this film, and the fixation we have with this date which has become a kind of "joke apocalypse" imagine what kind of media coverage that date will have when we are in the final week before. I'm sure the media will over-hype the "apocalypse" so much they will have people worried.

Remember which Cern were starting the Large Hadron Collider? People were positively frightened here in Norway with the kind of coverage that had in the news (yeah, we have so little to report here).

Could you imagine getting scared, or are you absolutely certain 2012 isn't the end? I for one, am not worried. Even if I was gonna die, The Armageddon should be quick and painless, and I won't be leaving anyone behind anyway. Saves me worrying about paying back my student loan.
Posted: Mon, 22nd Jun 2009, 10:05pm

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Sollthar

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Well, my opinion on Lucas being a total hack and his films being the most overrated movies in film history is clear, so no need to dwell on it. smile

Could you imagine getting scared, or are you absolutely certain 2012 isn't the end?
Seeing I don't lean the slightest bit to conspiracy-theories, religion, superstitious theories or general panic-mongering I have zero fear towards that date, or any other date as far as any armageddon goes. So no, I'm not scared nor can I imagine to get scared.
Posted: Tue, 23rd Jun 2009, 8:21am

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Simon K Jones

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Lucas didn't revolutionise the Hero's Journey, he just implemented it well. Like countless, countless other writers before and after him (that's why it's called the Hero's Journey, after all, because it's such a common, reliable format).
Posted: Tue, 23rd Jun 2009, 8:16pm

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Evman

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The way I look at it - I don't believe at all that the world will end in 2012. But just in case I'm wrong - everyone is dying with me, so I won't be missing anything. razz I've always thought it'd be cool to see the Apocalypse, afterall.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:05pm

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Simon K Jones

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OOOOoookay, topic resurrection time, because they've released an utterly INSANE-O-GRAM 5 minute clip from the film (although it appears to be edited together from several pieces):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZxBYItj2sM

I've no idea if it looks good or bad, but you have to admire the sheer lack of restraint.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:14pm

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Sollthar

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Hehe, awesome pussycat.

My ticket is so sold. cool
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:15pm

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Pooky

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I am so seeing this! It seems like they're finally going for incredibly over-the-top and silly rather than "PLEASE CRY NOW" drama like earlier disaster movies. Plus, seems like it has ridiculous amounts of money in the SFX department.

On the other hand, worst Arnold impersonation ever.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:27pm

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Pooky wrote:

I am so seeing this! It seems like they're finally going for incredibly over-the-top and silly rather than "PLEASE CRY NOW" drama like earlier disaster movies.
I'm sorry to say that judging by the trailer there will be some War of the Worlds 2005 style "family moments" in the film. On the other hand it looks like most of it will be perfected War of the Worlds 2005 style destruction!

Pooky wrote:

Plus, seems like it has ridiculous amounts of money in the SFX department.
Yeah ILM still has it. biggrin
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:31pm

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videofxuniverse

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not sure what is causing the chaos, (end of the world obviously) but i dont care, the sheer amazing effects of destruction and anarchy of the city did it for me. They really are going out on the don't matter if your old, young or a kid, your gonna get crushed by a million tons of building and ground
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:33pm

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Simon K Jones

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Pooky wrote:

I am so seeing this! It seems like they're finally going for incredibly over-the-top and silly rather than "PLEASE CRY NOW" drama like earlier disaster movies. Plus, seems like it has ridiculous amounts of money in the SFX department.
Yeah, I'm quite surprised at the level and scale of the VFX, considering that presumably 90% of the film is going to be on this level. I didn't know Emmerich could still command this kind of budget.

On the other hand, worst Arnold impersonation ever.
Heh, the lameness of the impression somehow makes it better, though. Also: how strange is it to have an impersonation of Arnie, except that impersonation is supposedly impersonating the REAL Arnold Schwarzenegger, not in a movie reference, but in his role as the REAL governor. There's something highly meta about that.

Also, the "California is going down!" line: brilliant.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:42pm

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videofxuniverse

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i can see it has the typical woman F@&ks everything up scenario that will get everyone killed we see in all films where they decide to trip over or in this case hang up on the poor sod who is trying to warn them to get out or your gonna die.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 3:50pm

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Simon K Jones

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3 best things in this clip:

1. The screaming plane. Yes, the plane actually screams at one point as it flies past. Brilliant.

2. John Cusack's "whoaaaaaaaahh!!!!" reaction as the plane flies out from underneath the building. The underacting is brilliant - I'm pretty sure this isn't how most people would react in the same situation.

3. John Cusack's relieved "phew!" reaction just after the plane has escaped. Again, I think I'd be more relieved. And more in shock. And more needing a change of pants.

Then again, he is JOHN CUSACK, survivor of disasters and expert DRIVING-AWAY-FROM-DISASTERS man. (I wonder how many cars he gets in to drive away from things? Limousine and camper van are covered so far)
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 4:44pm

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No Respite Productions

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I'm not sure what I find more disturbing, the idea of the entire planet seemingly collapse in on itself or the sight of John Cusack raping his own career.

I mean I know it's a fun disaster flick but would it have killed people to at least act like they're about to die.

I'm going to have to watch Grosse Point Blank now to recover.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 7:53pm

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jawajohnny

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Staff Only wrote:

Yeah ILM still has it. biggrin
It's not ILM... is it? I'm pretty sure it isn't. Anyway, I loved Emmerich's The Day After Tomorrow, and I also loved War of the Worlds, so I think there's a great chance I'll like 2012. I'm actually a big fan of the "family moments" in both those films. I think they're absolutely necessary in movies like this.
Posted: Mon, 5th Oct 2009, 8:03pm

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jawajohnny wrote:

Staff Only wrote:

Yeah ILM still has it. biggrin
It's not ILM... is it? I'm pretty sure it isn't.
Oh my. You're correct. I could swear I read it was ILM sometime. neutral

Proof that you are right.

That's pretty amazing. I feel completely hoodwinked.
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 12:30am

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jgtrox2

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I TOLD YOU. You just wait.
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 3:01am

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Atom

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I gotta admit, this loses me a little on the 'awesome!!111' factor and falls more into the 'sure, this is incredibly over-the-top; but that's still pretty scary to see a movie where this is literally NOTHING anyone can do to stop it.

Pretty ballsy, actually.
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 3:50am

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Aculag

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That clip is so over-the-top. They are literally RIGHT on the edge of disaster the entire time.

I was pretty skeptical at first, but if the whole movie is that balls-to-the-wall, I am totally there. Ridiculous.
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 7:29am

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Simon K Jones

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Atom wrote:

I gotta admit, this loses me a little on the 'awesome!!111' factor and falls more into the 'sure, this is incredibly over-the-top; but that's still pretty scary to see a movie where this is literally NOTHING anyone can do to stop it.

Pretty ballsy, actually.
Yeah, it's interesting how Emmerich's personal brand of disaster movie always seems so hopeless. Sure, in Day After Tomorrow a few of them survive, yay, but the world is still utterly, utterly borked and billions have died.

Same goes for 2012: TOTAL FRAKKING DESTRUCTION (official title), where it really does look like the entire planet is screwed. I'm intrigued to see how they pull a happy/hopeful ending out of that one. Be great if everyone actually does die. Maybe the final shot is the entire universe exploding?

Last edited Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 9:12am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 9:04am

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Tarn wrote:

I'm intrigued to see how they pull a happy/hopeful ending out of that one. Be great if everyone actually does die. Maybe the final shot is the entire universe exploding?
Or maybe the whole Earth will simply be under water. It all depends on if "The end of the world" means the end of our world, or The World (Universe).

If it were my film, mabye I would solve it by in the start showing a biology class being taught where the teacher shows the class what kind of single cell organisms in the ocean we were evolved from and what they look like. Then at the end I would have a shot that showed the organisms were in the ocean of the flooded Earth, showing that The End was just a reboot of humanity.

It works with the tagline as well: "Then end...is only the beginning."

The human race will live again. I guess that is hopeful to some (depressing to others razz).
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 11:00am

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I suspect it will end with some sort of space exploration. smile

Though there doesn't necessarily have to be a happy ending. I was slightly surprised by 'Knowing'

*Spoilers, highlight to read*
Because at the end of that movie, Aliens came to take away some children and then the entire world literally set on fire.
*Spoiler End*

I have to side with Aculag, in that if the entire film is non stop brink of destruction I think I'd enjoy the movie simply for how ridiculous it would be. Not totally surprised this isn't ILM - some of the distance shots are very blatant matte paintings and there's a general lack of 'people' during a lot of the shots. Maybe that's overly critical though.

As for Avatar. I think a lot of people misunderstand why it has so many people excited. The huge visual effects budget is only part of the parcel - the film is one of the first to incorporate stereoscopic live action and heavy CG. Those I knew who attended the 15 minute previews, Visual Effects professionals who I trust came out totally awed by how it looked.

Which is reason enough for me to want to see it smile
-Matt
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 4:13pm

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Atom

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Roger Ebert said he was underwhelmed and disappointed by the footage, which conversely is enough for me not to be excited about it. wink
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 4:21pm

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Simon K Jones

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I don't think there's any doubt that Avatar's gonna be a visual extravaganza - as Hybrid says, I'm perfectly happy to take the informed opinions of those VFX guys.

The question that remains - and which Ebert's opinion plays into more - is whether there's a good film underneath those visuals.

After all, even Titanic looked good.

"Oh, a Monet! I love...his use of colour!"

CLANG
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 6:43pm

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Hybrid-Halo wrote:

Those I knew who attended the 15 minute previews, Visual Effects professionals who I trust came out totally awed by how it looked.
Good to know. wink I really wish I had been able to attend a preview.

Tarn wrote:

The question that remains - and which Ebert's opinion plays into more - is whether there's a good film underneath those visuals.
Yeah, therein lies the rub. The thing with Avatar is it will have to be a exceptionally good film to get any kind of praise, because with the amount of hype it has it can't get away with being simply adequate leaning on good like for example Cloverfield. It has to be excellent. And since a lot of the main characters with the most screen time and the biggest location are both CGI the quality of the VFX work is imperative for the films success.
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 7:34pm

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videofxuniverse

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Avatar doesn't interest me too much fantasy, but if its one thing i do know that James Cameron is an excellent director who has an awesome eye for detail. He is also an obnoxious person to work with, everyone who has worked with him hates him as he will work his staff to tears (He actually made Ed Harris break down into tears on Abyss) just to get the perfect shot or effect. I heard he even took on a diving course and got a full licence just so he could go down and adjust the underwater lighting in abyss when everyone else went home. Also if anyone has the alien quadrilogy boxset look at the behind the scenes dvd in aliens and you can see first hand how aggressive and perfect he is. Most of the cast and crew have an "opinion" on him. So if he is in charge of Avater then i can assume he won't dissapoint
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 7:42pm

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Atom

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Rating: -2

Ugh, no comment.
Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 9:00pm

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videofxuniverse wrote:

everyone who has worked with him hates him as he will work his staff to tears (He actually made Ed Harris break down into tears on Abyss) just to get the perfect shot or effect.
A few things: Arnold Schwarzenegger, Jamie Lee Curtis and Sigourney Weaver defend Camerons directing and say it's not as bad as people say, and that he is not an inhumane crazy dictator on set.

Kate Winslet said she hated working on Titanic granted, and most of these rumors about Cameron come from the sets of Titanic and The Abyss, and I can honestly claim that anyone (who isn't Qui-Gon Jinn or Tarn) in charge of those shoots would be very stressed.

The Ed Harris crying thing is also fake. Ed Harris talks about it on the DVD. He cried in his car on the way home from filming because he almost drowned that day. Nothing to do with Cameron's directing. He did admit to being pretty pissed with Cameron during the shoot because Cameron created the situation that became probably the hardest cinematic shoot in history (at least it's up there with Star Wars, and Apocalypse Now, and gets extra points for being under water), and talked him into doing it.

Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio also walked off set once during The Abyss, when she was in the most intense scene in the film. She is naked, with freezing water on her (her character is unconscious), Ed Harris is performing CPR, and in the climax of the best take that day the camera ran out of film. Understandably she flipped out and walked off set. Ed Harris said Cameron was at a loss of words (in that he was very apologetic, but just didn't know what to say right after it happened).

No-one has said anything bad about his style on Avatar, and Cameron has said he has mellowed with age. Also I can't imagine Cameron being that stressed during Avatar when he shot the whole thing in hangars in his own good time with little to no budgetary constraints.

Lastly I would like to say that the fairest point against Cameron's directing comes from supposed crew members that have not enjoyed working on his sets. It is true that while Arnold Schwarzenegger, Jamie Lee Curtis and Sigourney Weaver walk away with fame, glory and awards when they work with Cameron, crew members are just doing another job and are paid roughly the same, so I can see why putting up with Cameron would feel completely different to them. Still I don't see what Winslet is whining about. She was the leading lady in Titanic. Even if Cameron had you scrubbing floors in the lunch breaks: shut the *beep* up.

The same goes for Megan Fox. If she really wanted everyone to think she was a such stuck up bi*ch that bad all she had to do was insult Michael Bay sooner. The moron. At least we got to see her getting her arse handed to her by the crew. Why do I think the letter is not a hoax? Because both Bay and Fox responded to it as if were real.

Just thought I'd clear that up. wink

EDIT:

ben3308 wrote:

someone needs to tell James Cameron that. Now let's get back on topic.
I think they did. Also, yes, let's get back on topic. smile

Last edited Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 6:53pm; edited 3 times in total.

Posted: Tue, 13th Oct 2009, 9:31pm

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ben3308

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videofxuniverse wrote:

Avatar doesn't interest me too much fantasy, but if its one thing i do know that James Cameron is an excellent director who has an awesome eye for detail. He is also an obnoxious person to work with, everyone who has worked with him hates him as he will work his staff to tears (He actually made Ed Harris break down into tears on Abyss) just to get the perfect shot or effect.
What is an excellent director? As the man in charge, does it sound like an excellent decision to alienate all those under your employ? Does having an eye for detail (usually something for a production designer or cinematographer) mean you get to be awful at everything else your job entails? Does pushing people to get performances to the point they're willing to quit make you a good director?

No. A director directs the set and the actors. Their job is not exclusive to controlling details, and someone needs to tell James Cameron that. Now let's get back on topic.
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 2:25am

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Aculag

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ben3308 wrote:

Their job is not exclusive to controlling details, and someone needs to tell James Cameron that. Now let's get back on topic.
Why don't you write him a detailed letter?

"Dear Mr. Cameron,

You're a film director. Now please act like one.

Love,
Ben (age 19)"
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 7:28am

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Simon K Jones

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Rating: +1

ben3308 wrote:

What is an excellent director? As the man in charge, does it sound like an excellent decision to alienate all those under your employ? Does having an eye for detail (usually something for a production designer or cinematographer) mean you get to be awful at everything else your job entails? Does pushing people to get performances to the point they're willing to quit make you a good director?
I'm not so sure. I'd say the primary purpose of the director is to ensure the project gets completed to either a high standard, or a profitable standard (ideally, both). What tactics they use to get to that point is up to them.

Now, that's not to say I approve of directors that terrorise their crews. Far from it. The best directors are the ones that can bring films in at a high quality and in a profitable manner, while also engendering a positive atmosphere.

But I'd say that being nice is a secondary objective, both when it comes to the 'art' and 'business' of filmmaking. It's not how I would want to direct - having a happy set is crucial to me. But just because you're a bastard doesn't mean you're a bad director, as long as the end product still works.
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 9:16am

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Tarn wrote:

I'd say the primary purpose of the director is to ensure the project gets completed to either a high standard, or a profitable standard (ideally, both). What tactics they use to get to that point is up to them.
I would agree with your reasoning. Well put. +1 One must not forget that while a lot of people love to slam Michael Bay and James Cameron for rumors surrounding their style, a many these people come up with lame excuses concerning Stanley Kubrick (not pointing at the Adams Bros. here, just people I know). Jack Nicholson, who loves Kubrick a lot, had to admit in a “Remembering Kubrick” piece he did for Empire that Kubrick really drove his people inhumanely hard. Nicholson remembers that for the tennis-ball throwing scene in The Shining, Kubrick still had him do 70+ takes for throwing a ball in the wall. He did not know how to bring something new every take and his arm was beyond dead by the time they wrapped the scene. Just putting this out there, but just because Kubrick supposedly makes more important films than Cameron and Bay doesn't make it any different. They all run their sets how they have to, to get their job done. While people tend to have idealized views when it comes to how musicians and filmmakers should be, in the end they are jobs, not religions.

But yes, about that topic we were supposed to be talking about...
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 6:23pm

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Atom

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Again, Kubrick is just as condemned for his reputation as he is lauded for his films. There's a very important distinction between alienating and isolating yourself by polarizing your cast and those you work with and being nice. Niceties are a courtesy, being able to work with people is a necessity- even in an assholey, cutthroat world like Hollywood.

Honestly, need I show you guys an episode of Entourage? smile
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 6:51pm

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Atom wrote:

Honestly, need I show you guys an episode of Entourage? smile
Maybe you do. wink

Even for a known Cameron fan, I've never seen a full episode. A girl in my class who's an Entourage fan and knows I'm a fan of Cameron showed me some of his cameos once, but apart from that I've not really watched the show. It's definitely on the ever longer "to watch" list I have.
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 7:04pm

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videofxuniverse

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1 last bit on cameron and im done back on topic. I didn't wanna come over that i didn't like him or think he is a fool, in fact someone who works his people and himself that hard is a very passionate director who will go to any lengths to get the right scene. He is a genius and as i said before he has an amazing eye for detail. His films always deliver great visual fx, i know that no film is ever flawless but he always manages to impress
Posted: Wed, 14th Oct 2009, 9:30pm

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Atom

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I wasn't talking so much about Cameron's bits in the show (which, granted, purposefully try and make him look easy to work with) I meant more of that in Entourage there's the constant dynamic that Hollywood is full of assholes and has no time for courtesy or politeness- but ultimately you still have to get along with people to a reasonable degree in order to get things done and last in the town.

Obviously it's just a show and has no finite basis on real life; but the dilemmas between 'oh, no one's nice and no one cares what you think' and 'oh, maybe they don't care but if I don't work with them I'm screwed' on episodes every now and then is really intriguing.

But with Cameron, alas, the way he worked in Entourage in creating the faux 'Aquaman' comic book movie just makes me dislike the fact he didn't actually make it and made Avatar instead even more. Mostly because Aquaman, for all Cameron's vices, seems right up his alley.
Posted: Fri, 6th Nov 2009, 10:35pm

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Tarn wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZxBYItj2sM

I've no idea if it looks good or bad, but you have to admire the sheer lack of restraint.
HD time:

480p
720p
1080p!

Enjoy. biggrin

The effects were a bit less impressive in some closeups in HD. The water looked really good coming over the mountain at the end, but some of the stuff was a bit obvious, like their house falling apart.