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real UFO? best ever footage close up of ship.

Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 7:38am

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b4uask30male

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Sorry if this has been posted before.

I saw on the news this footage last night, it was shot a few years ago in Turkey by a security gaurd at night, the craft came a few times over a 4 month period said the guard.

Click link below to see footage and interview with guard.
I'd love to know what you think.

http://www.siriusufo.org/tr/?fx=sayfa_ac&url=html/english/istanbul.asp

It's been proven not to be CGI.
I believe it's a real object and that it is in the sky but not seeing anything under it, eg: lights from a city or street lights makes it hard to the scale of it, or if it moves.

what do you think?
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 7:54am

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Joshua Davies

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Hey b4!

Personally I think its impossible to prove something isn't CGI these days unless you're there watching it begin filmed.

Given the poor quality of the footage I think it would be even harder to make this kind of judgement. For every "expert" who claims it isn't CGI I imagine you could find another who says it is.

I do believe that creatures exist on other planets - with 100 billion trillion planets out there its hard not to! I don't believe they travel all the way to Earth just to be caught on some amateur video before flying back off in to space.

smile
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 8:04am

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b4uask30male

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Hi

There is a better quality version, I think website grab footage from any source and then reformat it to fit there own site.

There's over 2 and a half hours of footage shot, too much for someone to have thought about doing it cgi, methinks.
I'm sure anyone doing the cgi route would have done just a few seconds I think

Have you seen the footage from nasa? with the rocket firing at something in space.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je7-eT7fFyg

If this is real then the speed that craft travels at is fast, fast enough not to worry if they take a wrong turn and end up at earth.
Or as stargate and others believe we are from aliens in the first place which would explain why they visit.

Your right about it being caught on camera? why bother flying at night if you allow yourself to be filmed?
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 8:06am

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Aculag

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Shaky cam? Check!

Nondescript, blurry shapes and vague outlines? Check!

Entirely black surroundings with absolutely no reference whatsoever? Check!

Experts claiming authenticity? Check!

Yes, I'm afraid this has all the classic signs of being exactly the same as every other piece of UFO footage that has ever become available. That is to say, "no, it is obviously and absolutely not real." sad

Trust me, I'm a believer, but if I wasn't, this would not be the video to convince me.

Schwar: Consider the possibility that just because it's a UFO, that doesn't necessarily mean it came from space! These sightings could just as easily be top-secret government aircraft, or even spookier, top-secret subterranean humanoid reptile aircraft. wink The fact that a lot of sightings seem to be in remote, or rural areas is very telling, I think.

Edit: Hadn't seen that NASA clip before. Pretty cool, but again, that could be damn near anything. I want to believe! It hurts to think that someone out there knows the truth and is hiding it. Or, equally bad, that no one knows the truth... *sigh* Aliens.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 9:14am

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b4uask30male

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Another point I like to think of, what did the guard get from it?

I've seen the fake crop circles appear only to find out the people that filmed it have their own cgi company.

Did this guard make money? has he got a model fx company?

Do you remember the alien autopsy (spelt wrong sorry) the guy Ray said he didn't take any money from it, we know it was fake (although he claimed to have seen real footage and copied it with a few frames spliced in his fake footage) what do people gain from faking it?

Anyone remember the hub cap? a man in the USA had a car hub cap (rim) suspended by fishing wire in the air, fooled a lot of people, now I think because there are so many fakes all we will ever see if fake even if it's real, another thing that will stop us believing when we do see it, films and cgi, they are so damm good now we couldn't tell the difference.

What if this craft footage was real, would you live your life any different?
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 9:29am

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Joshua Davies

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Aculag... Yeah, if it wasn't CGI I would go for something secret but of this Earth...
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 9:32am

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Arktic

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Looks like a slightly deflated weather balloon to me.

The fact that there's nothing in the video to act as a reference for scale or even location, it just looks out-and-out fake to me.

I mean, because it's against a totally black background, it could easily be a bit of tin, lying on a black sheet, being filmed by one person while someone else waves a torch around a bit...

Do you remember the alien autopsy (spelt wrong sorry) the guy Ray said he didn't take any money from it, we know it was fake (although he claimed to have seen real footage and copied it with a few frames spliced in his fake footage) what do people gain from faking it?
Some genuinely believe that it's true, but without solid evidence to back it up, make the evidence up to support their claims. Others are just mischievous, some are looking for money, some are just looking for fame and attention.

I worked on a series for C5 some time ago, called Britiain's Closest Encounters. I had to wade through a LOT of information and research on the subject, and speak to some very interesting people - and there was a lot of compelling evidence and curious accounts of what people had experienced; but I just don't think that the things they experienced were really alien encounters. I think that much of what they saw or found could be explained by much more earthly (and simple) phenomena or events. And for each story that made you think 'there might be something in this', there were at least two more stories from someone else who was either clearly a crackpot, or who had blatantly made a very simple error, but was convinced that what they saw (or often, what they'd been told by someone else) was the truth - and the balance of evidence seemed to shift towards the viewpoint that we had not been visited by aliens in any sense that was possible for anyone to prove.

But that's not to say that I don't believe in alien life! I'm probably 99% certain that there's intelligent life out in the universe somewhere. I just think that if they had the technology to travel through time and space to visit us, they probably wouldn't just hover around in the background. They're either here, and so sophisticated technologically that we can't sense them (in which case, logic tells us that they might as well not be here!); or they're not here at all. If I were an alien, and I'd spent thousands of lightyears on my way to visit another planet, I would make sure the people there KNEW I was there. Not draw a pretty pattern in some poor farmer's crop, or just sort of fly about a bit at night where one or two people could see me smile

Cheers,
Arktic.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 10:01am

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Simon K Jones

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Aculag wrote:

The fact that a lot of sightings seem to be in remote, or rural areas is very telling, I think.
People that live in the countryside are a little unhinged?
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 10:27am

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pdrg

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Now District 9, that was footage of spaceships over a city I could believe!

Time. Time is big. So's space. We've only been capable of getting off our planet for 50-something years, and made it as far as Mars or Jupiter or somewhere. Civilisations have come and gone in the past 10,000 years, right here on Earth. Huge civilisations.

10,000 years is *nothing* in the cosmic timescales, so we have to consider not just that space is huge, but that time is huge, so any alien space audit from 10,000 years ago would have visited Earth, seen us grubbing about for worms with no real way to record our visit, and left. And there are a *lot* of stars out there, with planets, etc. Inevitably there will be life elsewhere, maybe sentient beings who discover how to escape their planet and reach out for other life forms, but if they were a few thousand years ago, or in the future, we won't know about it.

Then there's *this* problem http://xkcd.com/638/ which I think sums up our attitude to beaming out radio waves and listening for SETI patterns. wink
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 10:31am

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b4uask30male

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All good points there guys.

Lets say I was trying to make fake footage, what would you need to see to believe it? ofcourse shaking hand's with ET would be the best but pretending I had a camera one day or night, what would clinch it for you?
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 10:37am

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Simon K Jones

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I wouldn't believe any video, for the reasons stated above. It's too easy to do convincing visual effects these days.

Any video would have to be accompanied by additional evidence - lots of eyewitness accounts from unconnected people, for example, and general corroboration across several news sources.

Same goes for any event or news item, really.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 12:59pm

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jotoki

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I'd personally never believe it unless I saw it with my own eyes AND ET popped out to say hello. UFO means Unidentified flying object NOT alien spaceship. So just becuase I saw something flying I couldn't identify wouldn't make me think it was a spaceship. If that's someones first conclusion to seeing something in the sky they don't recognise, well same as someone seeing somthing else they can't explain and so straight away go for the supernatural explaination; Well you have to wonder about their mindset really
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 1:03pm

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Simon K Jones

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jotoki wrote:

If that's someones first conclusion to seeing something in the sky they don't recognise, well same as someone seeing somthing else they can't explain and so straight away go for the supernatural explaination; Well you have to wonder about their mindset really
Chance of topic veering towards religious discussion: up to 65%

I think it's wishful thinking in a lot of cases. I know when I was a teenager I desperately wanted there to be something 'more' out there, to make the universe a more exciting and interesting place. I didn't have any interest in religion, but I was fairly addicted to science ficion: thus 'I want to believe' was a concept I could understand.

I'd still love for there to be evidence of alien life (whether intelligent or microbial; it doesn't really matter), but the core realisation since my teenage years is that even without alien and UFOs the universe it still absolutely amazing. Hell, not even the universe: just our planet on its own is staggeringly amazing.

As was discussed in (I think) the Avatar topic, sometimes people fixate so much on embracing a more exciting fiction that they overlook the wonders on their own doorstep.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 1:14pm

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Hybrid-Halo

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b4uask30male wrote:

Another point I like to think of, what did the guard get from it?
What do people get from any publicity? Some excitement to punctuate their otherwise boring lives.

I'm filing this video under "Unconvincing" alongside all the others.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 1:18pm

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Simon K Jones

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A question I've always wanted to know about it why people that film UFOs are such awful cameramen. You could say it's because they're just members of the public, but I don't buy that: look at any recent disaster, whether 9/11 or the London tube bombings, or the big tsunami, and there's some really 'good quality' material in there, both still photos and video.

Maybe the aliens have a special wobblecam ray?
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 3:22pm

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Sollthar

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I think it's darth vaders's personal spaceship in which he travels to the gnome's hideout to chat about the wrong doings of mankind and play some dice game in order to decide who gets a vasectomy and who gets drowned in berry sirup.

Prove otherwise.


At the end of the day, videos like these get people's fantasy going and quite obviosly, to some these videos are proof of an alien race developped enough to have space travel which just visits us briefly to fly away, to others it's a faked video to gain attention/publicity or maybe it's just a video by a random guy who saw something he couldn't decide what it was and genuinly believes to be an UFO despite the fact it's not.

(analogy edited to not have religious reference in it, sorry for that)

Last edited Thu, 28th Jan 2010, 7:02am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 4:17pm

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pdrg

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up5jmbSjWkw
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 4:22pm

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Simon K Jones

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Hehe, gotta love all the YouTube commenters who think they're being really clever and intelligent by identifying it as a fake.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 6:13pm

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b4uask30male

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I had a look at the whole interview with the guard.
Some interesting things,
He said the craft was over the sea.

He used a canon dv camera with a sony zoom lens adaptor giving 100x zoom.

He took 3 months to show anyone the footage as his mother was ill and there was a death in the family.

behind him was the town but he didn't want to waste his battery by showing the town behind him.

He said it was always zoomed in (no wide shots) because he didn't want to waste tape or battery on nothing (although my view is that he shot over 2 hours of footage the least he could have done is one wide shot!)

So after watching the interview it's made me think the guard is an idiot!
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 8:07pm

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Atom

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Because why wouldn't it be b4uaskmale30 who starts a thread based on the 'truth' of UFO sightings...
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 8:33pm

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rogolo

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As far as "aliens visiting earth" goes, I've always liked Michi Kaku's oft-repeated metaphor of the anthill. Check out the rest of the video for a few more alien/extraterrestrial-related tibdits.

Atom: You wouldn't happen to know this Texan who believes in UFOs, do you? smile
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 9:23pm

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b4uask30male

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Sorry Atom not sure what you mean and i'll pretend it's a nice comment smile

I'm not saying it's real but I was really interested in hearing from people like the members on fxhome because if it is fake then they would have a view on how it was done.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 10:07pm

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Aculag

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The fact is though, there is no detail in the video at all. It's obviously not really an alien ship, but if we were to try and figure out "how" it was faked, no one will be able to because the video is mostly blackness with some blurry curved lines sometimes. It could be anything.
Posted: Tue, 26th Jan 2010, 11:29pm

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Thrawn

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I highly doubt that there is any alien life forms out there, or at least any that have visited earth. All of the evidence that has been presented to me on the matter is very unconvincing. Of course, part of the reasoning is my religion, but for the sake of the thread, I won't go into that.

I don't think any type of video could possibly convince me, for reasons already discussed. Sort of ironic, but even though my life is based off of faith in a God that I can't see, the only way for me to be convinced of Aliens is to study one with my own two eyes. smile

It's certainly an interesting theory though. I'd say the "mystery" of aliens is one of the few things that keeps life interesting for some people.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 1:02am

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Aculag

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Thrawn wrote:

I highly doubt that there is any alien life forms out there, or at least any that have visited earth. All of the evidence that has been presented to me on the matter is very unconvincing. Of course, part of the reasoning is my religion, but for the sake of the thread, I won't go into that.
This is really interesting to me. I understand the skepticism over whether aliens have visited our planet from others or not. There's a lot of empty space out there, and even if a civilization had discovered faster than light travel, it would still be a waste of time to try and visit any distant planets. Unless they're also immortal. wink

But why do you doubt the existence of life elsewhere? You admit yourself that your religion requires you to believe in a god that is entirely intangible. Yet you can't believe that in the infinite expanse of our universe, among the billions and billions of galaxies, and among trillions and trillions of stars and presumably innumerable planets, Earth is not the only place where life exists?

I don't want to spark a religious debate here, you believe what you want, I am just curious to hear your exact reasonings for this. I am almost certain that I will never see an actual extraterrestrial entity in my lifetime, but I have no doubt whatsoever that intelligent life does exist elsewhere. Probably even in our galaxy. It seems completely improbable that it wouldn't. Even if the odds against it are a trillion to one, it still happened here, and that tells me that it has to have happened somewhere else. It almost sounds selfish to think otherwise.

Ps. If this is tipping the scales too much in favor of religious debate, someone say something and I'll edit this and discuss it via PM with Thrawn.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 1:36am

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jawajohnny

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I think it's worth mentioning the Vatican has acknowledged the likelihood of life existing beyond our planet.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 6:57am

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Thrawn

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Aculag wrote:

Thrawn wrote:

I highly doubt that there is any alien life forms out there, or at least any that have visited earth. All of the evidence that has been presented to me on the matter is very unconvincing. Of course, part of the reasoning is my religion, but for the sake of the thread, I won't go into that.
This is really interesting to me. I understand the skepticism over whether aliens have visited our planet from others or not. There's a lot of empty space out there, and even if a civilization had discovered faster than light travel, it would still be a waste of time to try and visit any distant planets. Unless they're also immortal. wink

But why do you doubt the existence of life elsewhere? You admit yourself that your religion requires you to believe in a god that is entirely intangible. Yet you can't believe that in the infinite expanse of our universe, among the billions and billions of galaxies, and among trillions and trillions of stars and presumably innumerable planets, Earth is not the only place where life exists?

I don't want to spark a religious debate here, you believe what you want, I am just curious to hear your exact reasonings for this. I am almost certain that I will never see an actual extraterrestrial entity in my lifetime, but I have no doubt whatsoever that intelligent life does exist elsewhere. Probably even in our galaxy. It seems completely improbable that it wouldn't. Even if the odds against it are a trillion to one, it still happened here, and that tells me that it has to have happened somewhere else. It almost sounds selfish to think otherwise.

Ps. If this is tipping the scales too much in favor of religious debate, someone say something and I'll edit this and discuss it via PM with Thrawn.
Okay, first just wanted to say that if my comments do offend anyone or go too far into the "religious" side of things for everyone, to just edit my post, and I'll also pick it up over PM if Aculag wants.

It's hard to discuss why I don't believe in alien life without sounding like a religious nut job, but I'll go ahead anyways. My belief is that the world was created by God, as I'm sure you well know. In the beginning, after God's rest on the seventh day, he creates man "from the dust of the ground" "in his image." The Bible only states that "In the beginning" God created the heavens and the earth. No where does it mention a creation of another species. Now, if you've played along so far, I know you're saying that he never said he didn't create another alien race. But why would he? And did he send his only son to that planet as well? Did he give them the word of God? Granted, those are only questions, but somehow I'd guess that one perfect creation was enough for God.

This all depends on my religious beliefs, as I've stated. If I wasn't a Christian, I could see how you could believe there were other planets that supported life forms. I mean, the world "just happened" to you guys, so why (after billions of years) couldn't it happen again? I get it. My religious beliefs just beg the question of why God would bother creating another species, and I think since that there is no mention of it in the bible, in addition to no scientific evidence, leads me to believe that there is no Aliens of any type out there.

And I hope you don't misunderstand my statement about believing in a God I cannot see as me comparing God to Aliens. Quite the contrary, actually. I do believe there is evidence (along with common logic) that supports the fact that there is a God, though I'm sure 90% of you would disagree. I would however, like you guys to ignore this last paragraph, as it's probably too religious to be discussed. I just wanted to clear that up.

Hope I got the point across alright smile
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 8:32am

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pdrg

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Christianity and Aliens, to me, and if taken by the letter of the book, are still reconcilable. Sure there's no mention of creating other planets in the book he dictated to Earth many millennia later, but then he doesn't make reference to Earth in the books he dictated to other planets and civilisations. He sent his only son to us, but his only squeenzj to planet B, his only fluxnnra to planet C, his only ppprythnnia to planet D, etc.

I mean the Earth, stars, planets, etc were around an awful lot longer than life, dinosaurs, mankind, etc (demonstrably millions of Earth years, not just a couple of Earth days), so that would give an omnipotent being a chance to work on other projects? Unless we worship a minor god, and there's a heirarchy with one assigned to each planet/civilisation, then an all-powerful God would shepherd us as he does other species and lifeforms on other planets - and I find that more reassuring than worshipping a minor god, you know?
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 8:42am

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Atom

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Rating: +1

For me it's a matter of liking to feel special. I don't think there's life out there because I want to be part of the most developed race of beings in the universe. I want to and am. There's nothing out there, we'll never have 'proof'. Even an alien standing in front of me now wouldn't convince me. We're the brightest and most complex creatures with civilization. Earth has the only life anywhere ever. The end. Ignorance to all else.

Yes, I'm just that cocky.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 8:56am

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CX3

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Wow
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:19am

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Simon K Jones

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I want aliens to arrive now, mainly to knock Atom down a peg or two. wink

I love pdrg's alien species names. Genius!
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:22am

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Atom

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Their arrival will go great with my kill-first-ask-questions-later policy.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:29am

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Simon K Jones

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As long as I have tickets to watch, I don't care! smile
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:36am

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Aculag

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Thrawn wrote:

Explanation.
Okay. Well it sounds kinda crazy to me, but taking this any further would lead to this thread being locked/heavily edited, so I'll just back away slowly now. wink

Atom, you are even crazier than Thrawn, but your internet persona is getting pretty hilarious.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:42am

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Atom

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I figured self-parody is much easier and less messy than genuine care and conviction with alls you'se guys.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 11:43am

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Simon K Jones

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Interesting article that dances around some of the topics discussed here:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/jan/27/aliens-cant-hear-us-astronomer
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 2:02pm

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Rockfilmers

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What if WE are the most intelligent creatures in the whole universe? I love how people automatically assume that aliens would be thousands or even millions of year ahead of us in technology. Personally, I think the search for aliens is a fascinating pseudoscience.

When it comes to Christianity, I think it may possible for there to be real aliens. But like I said, I don't consider aliens to be little green men walking around with lasers, taking over planets in their UFOs, and abducting little kids in mountain towns to give them anal probes. If they found bacteria on Mars, it would be alien. Who knows, the bacteria may be even smarter than we are wink
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 2:37pm

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Hybrid-Halo

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The problem with religion and aliens is that God, however you look at him/her/it is an Alien. So if you believe in God, by default you believe in life elsewhere in the universe or that which is not native to Earth.

That's kind of how I always saw it.

Regarding automatic assumptions... The facts are that we're not really exploring distant planets which support life. So if we were to make contact with aliens they'd have to be more technologically advanced than us to have found us.

I like the idea of super intelligent bacteria from Mars, though. smile

If you're interested in an intelligent search for extra-terrestrial life, I think http://www.seti-inst.edu/ are pretty cool. Searching for traces of foreign technology in the galaxy.

-Matt
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 2:53pm

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Rockfilmers

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It's interesting because I am actually reading Contact by Carl Sagan, this topic could not have popped up at a better time.

The problem with religion and aliens is that God, however you look at him/her/it is an Alien. So if you believe in God, by default you believe in life elsewhere in the universe or that which is not native to Earth.
Although I can see your point, most religions (including my "religion") view God as omnipresent and omniscient, which means he is every where at once. He is on Mars the same time as Earth and Saturn and the Orion Nebula and the Andromeda Galaxy, ect. He's is not from a particular place, but every where.

I have read some puffed up professors paper (sorry, I don't remember his name) that says the reason that we can't find other intelligent life is because they destroyed themselves already in war. And people actually believe he is right without any proof (Religion?).

My views on aliens is that I could care less if we ever find out. I think it would be cool to see one, but no different than discovering a new species on the bottom of the ocean.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 3:03pm

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Simon K Jones

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The main benefit from the discovery of alien life, particularly alien life, is that it could potentially do two things:

1. End the arrogance of the human race, which has caused us to make amusing assumptions about the universe. ie, the Earth is at the centre of the universe. Humans are the only intelligent life, and we're somehow different to other creatures. Sun goes round the Earth. We're created to be perfect. Bla bla bla.

2. Make humans recognise that we are indeed a single species and defining and splitting us by colour/creed/opinion/nationality/etc is silly and counter-productive.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 3:18pm

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Thrawn

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Aculag wrote:

Thrawn wrote:

Explanation.
Okay. Well it sounds kinda crazy to me, but taking this any further would lead to this thread being locked/heavily edited, so I'll just back away slowly now. wink
Haha, I really didn't expect you to accept my answer, or even think it was sane, but hey, you asked wink Thanks for being polite about it though, as that's something few people on here actually are about topics such as this.


The problem with religion and aliens is that God, however you look at him/her/it is an Alien. So if you believe in God, by default you believe in life elsewhere in the universe or that which is not native to Earth.
Also just wanted to clear that up a touch. We don't see God as an alien. God isn't some life form on another planet devising how to rule the world in a way he sees fit. He's been there since before the beginning of time, and he's not a physical being. He created life, he is not reliant on it.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 3:19pm

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Rockfilmers

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How do you know the aliens don't separate by race, religion, opinion? What if they have even more problems than we do? Everyone seems to think that aliens would be perfect and bring enlightenment to us. I would be willing to argue that there is just as much chance for the opposite.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 3:35pm

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Simon K Jones

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Oh, absolutely. However, the presence of an entirely external force does have the potential for us to realise that, basically, "we're all in it together".

It's why a malevolent alien species would actually be far better for the progression of the human race than a benevolent one - assuming that we actually have a chance of surviving. smile

I'm not saying that's how it'd go down, just that without a Global Unifying Factor (GUF), most humans will only ever think of themselves in smaller terms.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 3:39pm

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Arktic

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Rating: +3

I heard a really interesting fact last night.

If you took a 5 pence piece (about the same size as a dime), and somehow suspended it 75 feet away from you in the night sky, the area of sky that that tiny speck covers contains 3,000 GALAXIES. And each of those galaxies will have anything from as 'little' as TEN MILLION up to A TRILLION stars, just like our own sun.

Now, are you telling me, that in all those trillions and trillions of stars in an area of sky the size of a 5p coin viewed from 75 feet away (i.e. a tiny, tiny speck), that none of those suns have evolved any kind of life at any point?

And consider how old those stars are... scientists have estimated that the light coming from those galaxies is up to 11 BILLION light years away. Remember that life on earth has only been around for something like 3.8 billion years. And sentient life has only been here for 600 million years or so.

What are the chances of our little rock developing life in it's (comparatively short) existence of 4.5 billion years, compared to planets from solar systems that have been around two or even three times as long as that. Are you seriously telling me that all those other stars have nothing but dead, empty, lifeless planets orbiting them ceaselessly?

Even if you do believe in god, there's nothing that conventional religious texts say about this being the only planet, or us being the only life. I mean, if you want to believe the Bible literally word-for-word, God *only* created animals, angels and man - but the Bible doesn't say that the Earth was the only location for man. Who knows, maybe the other galaxies are just inhabited by monkeys, or even angels. Or they could also be home to another group of humans. It's entierly within the realm of possibility and/or the 'rules' of the Bible.

I mean, why would God even bother to make 10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 other stars (and that's a conservative estimate) but not do anything with them?

To sort of paraphrase Humphrey Bogart in Casablanca*...

Of all the planets orbiting all the stars, in all the galaxies... God had to bring life to this one? wink

Cheers,
Arktic.

* - Someone needs to make a re-imagining set in space. It could be titled "Casablanca... IN SPACE". This is a good idea.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 4:58pm

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Rockfilmers

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That's really interesting, Arctik. Here is a picture taken by Hubble (Yeah American Tax Payers!) of an uninteresting spot of the sky in the big dipper. http://www.tinymars.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/ultradeepfield.jpg Each speck is a galaxy. The only problem is, THERE IS NO WAY TO GET THERE! Even at the speed of light it would take billions of years. The same goes for them. The only possible alien race any of us could possibly make contact with is in this galaxy, and so far nothing.

I would also like to point out another possibility, and I am being totally honest. Parallel universes mathematically exist. There more than tree dimensions (excluding the fourth, time). What if there are beings taking up the very same space, but in a different set of dimensions that we can not experience. There are billions of possibilities.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:14pm

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Sollthar

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I deleted and edited a couple of posts that went deep into religion.

You're all entitled to your opinions but there's a reason it's a forbidden topic, even if some mods forget that from time to time. We all are glad to be reminded of it.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 9:24pm

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pdrg

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Arktic wrote:

* - Someone needs to make a re-imagining set in space. It could be titled "Casablanca... IN SPACE". This is a good idea.
Agreed. One for a 5:19 special? wink
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 10:16pm

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RodyPolis

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Sollthar wrote:

I think it's god's personal spaceship in which he travels to the spaghetti monsters hideout to chat about the wrong doings of mankind and play some dice game in order to decide who gets a vasectomy and who gets drowned in berry sirup.
Is the spaghetti monster like the official 'christian mock tactic' word used by atheist all across the world? Because it can't be a coincidence that every atheist I've encountered says it; and that no one else does.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 10:18pm

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Aculag

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No, it's a different spaghetti monster that you're just hearing about now.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 10:35pm

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Rockfilmers

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Understood ,Sollthar, but why is it OK for you to mock a religion and then go back and edit others post for having religious themes in the post. I don't want to jump to anything, but it's kind of hypocritical, especially since there was no real conflict going on between posts.

Sollthar wrote:
I think it's god's personal spaceship in which he travels to the spaghetti monsters hideout to chat about the wrong doings of mankind and play some dice game in order to decide who gets a vasectomy and who gets drowned in berry sirup.

Is the spaghetti monster like the official 'christian mock tactic' word used by atheist all across the world? Because it can't be a coincidence that every atheist I've encountered says it; and that no one else does.
The flying spaghetti monster was created to 'show' Christians (and other people's religions), how easy it is to make up a story. However, the greatest flaw in the FSM 'proof' is that they are basing it off of their opinion that it is all made up. It's kind of weird. I have found in discussions at work that most atheist have just as much, if not more, faith because they don't believe in any higher power, even though there is no proof that none exists. There is no way that you can prove one way or the other. You have faith either way.
Posted: Wed, 27th Jan 2010, 10:39pm

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Arktic

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster

It's a particular parody religion that was originally designed as a counter argument to certain proposals about religious teachings in schools. You can read the Wiki article for more info.

But you don't have to be an atheist to see some of the sense in what they're saying (especially stuff like 'correlation does not imply causation').

Cheers,
Arktic.
Posted: Thu, 28th Jan 2010, 5:53am

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Sollthar

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Ah, I was using the word "god" here not in a christian sense, but in a rethorical sense - basically just like the spaghetti monster (where I mostly just love the word "spaghetti monster", to be honest).
The word "god" implies to me a fictional creature with supernatural powers, a bit like "fairy" or "X-Men" or "jedi" would to you. I keep forgetting that in this forum so many people get insulted by that.

I was just trying to say how impossible it is to state anything and prove otherwise when the statement itself is so out there. Not to refer to religion, but the debate about wheter this is an actual alien space ship or a faked video.

I apologize, I wasn't trying to actually refer to religion or mock it. I edited the post and replaced the questionable words with metaphors that are hopefully less offensive unless maybe to die hard star wars fans. smile

Bad thinking on my part. I'm Sorry.


Now let's finally get back to aliens!