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Canon T2i

Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 12:25am

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The Nemesis2161

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Well, I got it! I got the Canon T2i but its very difficult to adapt to it, not sure how to maximize its settings, anyone have any tips?

But mainly, whats really pissing me off is that during film recording, the exposure always sets to auto, no matter what! How do I do this?????????

-David
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 12:51am

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Axeman

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You have to set the dial to Manual. In any of the other settings, it will automatically adjust at least one of the variables to match the auto exposure reading.

What specific troubles are you having adapting to it?
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 1:19am

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The Nemesis2161

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Yes, capturing...my 2009 mac book pro can't capture any of my footage or clips, only in iphoto and some of the settings, its weird, I've tried all my programs...
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 1:24am

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Axeman

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You don't have to capture it, as such. You just plug in the memory card, and drag the video files onto your harddrive, wherever you want to store them.

Alternately, if you have Final Cut Pro you can use the capturing plug-in they released to convert the files to a good intermediate codec (ProRes) while transferring them from the card. If you don't have FCP, you can use MPEGstreamclip, which is free, to do the same thing, either straight from the card or after you have copied the files to your machine.
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 1:26am

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swintonmaximilian

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What do you mean by capture? The MOV files should be in your cards folder, and you just take them right out of there. No capturing involved, although perhaps I'm misunderstanding?
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 1:40am

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The Nemesis2161

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my computer doesn't have a card reader...should I invest in one?
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 1:42am

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miker

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The Nemesis2161 wrote:

my computer doesn't have a card reader...should I invest in one?
You should just be able to plug the camera into your computer via USB.. with the cable that came with the camera.
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 1:43am

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Axeman

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Yes. You can always plug in the camera, using the cable that came with it, but a $10 card reader will be noticeably faster for transferring files. If you are using UDMA cards, then you can get a UDMA reader to match, for even faster transfers, at a higher cost, but even the cheapest reader you can find will be an improvement over plugging in the camera.
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 2:04am

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The Nemesis2161

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miker,
seriously man, I tried that thats one of the issues I've been dealing with, my computer doesn't like this camera.

Anyways, looks like I will buy one, and Axeman, the auto exposure on the manual dial is worse than the rest, its much, much less correcting, but the corrections are much quicker and makes a much more drastic change. I'll just go back to the store and ask for help or something, this is kind of ridiculous, I just don't feel like I'm using it correctly, I don't entirely believe that this is the camera people have been raving about, not that theres anything really wrong with it, just the picture so far hasn't been as good, so I guess I'll have to sink in like 300 bucks for better lens's and what not, its just not a very easy camera to use.
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 2:07am

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swintonmaximilian

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Turn off auto focus, turn of auto exposure, turn off auto everything. Use it on full manual mode. Also, read the instructions, and learn about photography, that will help you out a lot.
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 2:18am

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The Nemesis2161

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Axeman, another thing, when on manual settings, the camera won't let me turn off or edit the iso levels, making them do it auto, so now I have no exposure change just iso changes, which look worse....what should I do?
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 2:47am

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Thrawn

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The Nemesis2161 wrote:

Axeman, another thing, when on manual settings, the camera won't let me turn off or edit the iso levels, making them do it auto, so now I have no exposure change just iso changes, which look worse....what should I do?
Look at the manual.
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 2:48am

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The Nemesis2161

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I did, it should be working according to the manuel but it isn't...I sort of got it though, this is all new to me, the mode organizing is kind of off putting
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 2:52am

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Thrawn

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Okay, well if things aren't working according to the manual, than you have a problem. Something tells me that you're just misunderstanding the instructions. But here, I'll give you the instructions that you can clearly find in the manual.

To switch your ISO on video mode, press the ISO button (located by your on and off switch) and use the left and right buttons (or the exposure scroll wheel) to switch the ISO from "Auto" to whatever level you want. Press the ISO button again, and the scroll wheel returns to controlling the exposure, as opposed to the ISO.

Make sense?
Posted: Thu, 8th Jul 2010, 3:36am

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ben3308

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Mode organizing?

There should only be one mode you ever use, the movie mode. Which should be set to all manual all the time.
Posted: Fri, 9th Jul 2010, 3:55pm

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pdrg

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Rating: +1

May this be a reminder to us all, what's best for one person may not be best for another...

In this case possibly The Nemesis2161 has bought the camera on the basis of everyone praising its awesomeness, but without being at the stage ready to take full advantage of all those manual features that one must use to get the most from the camera.

DSLR's as video cameras really require you to understand how to get great results from an SLR for stills before ever venturing into video. Luckily there are rakes of excellent technical photography books (and the technical ones are the ones you want) out there, or a photography class will teach you heaps too. Then getting awesome video will be an advancement of getting awesome stills smile
Posted: Fri, 9th Jul 2010, 4:37pm

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Garrison

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Is it possible that you (Nemesis2161) require an instructional video/dvd instead of the manual?

The reason I ask is that I am one of those people that have difficulty with text manuals and am much more visual. I've learned FCP by watching purchasing said DVDs and never read the manuals. I did the same when I bought the 7D.

If so, it may be worth your time to do likewise before giving up.
Posted: Fri, 9th Jul 2010, 7:28pm

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ben3308

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Just find a way to turn the settings to manual on the video mode, and use the three changeable items (ISO, shutter, and f-stop) to change exposure from there. We say "all those manual features" like it's a huge deal, but really it's just two things at a basic level: exposure and focus. Focus is extremely straightforward, so there's no "I don't understand" room there. biggrin Exposure can be pared down to only two things, easy, if you turn on auto ISO.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X4RbTcT57g

It's really not complicated. In fact, the beauty of the SLR camera is that earlier on it was easily learned by anyone, and its images came so clear and easily with simple, 35 and 50mm lenses that looked like real life, that it became a favorite amongst everyday photographers.

There are features on the T2i that are slightly more difficult - Picture Styles, Highlight Tone Priority, etc - but once they're set, they're set, and you should pretty much never have to touch them again.

Hit up the "HDSLRs Around FXHome" thread, I remember writing down a pretty thorough instructional there about exposure and the T2i.
Posted: Fri, 9th Jul 2010, 11:40pm

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CX3

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pdrg wrote:

May this be a reminder to us all, what's best for one person may not be best for another...

In this case possibly The Nemesis2161 has bought the camera on the basis of everyone praising its awesomeness, but without being at the stage ready to take full advantage of all those manual features that one must use to get the most from the camera.

DSLR's as video cameras really require you to understand how to get great results from an SLR for stills before ever venturing into video. Luckily there are rakes of excellent technical photography books (and the technical ones are the ones you want) out there, or a photography class will teach you heaps too. Then getting awesome video will be an advancement of getting awesome stills smile
It's a little overwhelming at first but even after a week I bet he'll be happy with his purchase. I know I was (With my 7D). This was my first DSLR ever so I didn't know s*** when I got it ha. But I have a very good grasp on it now, as will Nemesis soon enough. Keep it on M setting and play with it if you have a T2i because I don't think it gives you the option to set a custom C1, C2 & C3 dial.
Posted: Sat, 10th Jul 2010, 1:04am

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ben3308

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On the T2i you can set Picture Styles through the main menu or in the EOS Utility on the computer; then select them during shooting easily through the Quick Menu. I basically have my 'Q' button go to Marvels Cine Picture Style, which is my main shooting preset, although I can easily use the main wheel to change to my own 'Neutral' preset or the green-and-blue balanced 'Atomic' preset I've made.
Posted: Sun, 18th Jul 2010, 9:32pm

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The Nemesis2161

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yeah, I fully know how to use the T2i now, fully. I am very pleased with both the video and the photography it can pull off while being very small and lightweight;


BUT what makes me mad is the fact that the T2i takes about three times (for me) to set up, the zoom doesn't work because the camera adjusts the aperture (even when your iso/exposure is locked, not a big deal though), and I am normally a tech savvy person, but it took me like 3 days to learn how to do it, and it was a nightmare, but I am glad I purchased it, and so fare my whole setup has been less than $1500 .

To anyone looking for a video camera: I don't think so. Its not what you think, its very hard to use, in my opinion. Lens's are also very expensive.

But my number one problem with the T2i is the 'jello' effect, when too shakey it gets distorted, and I'm not quite sure on how to fix that without frame by frame FCP editing.

But seriously, it has a few major problems: can't zoom without lighting change, 12 minute clip max., has the HD 'jello' effect (number one problem with it.)
Posted: Sun, 18th Jul 2010, 9:42pm

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Axeman

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Well, exposure changes when zooming only affect cheap lenses, to start with, but you aren't meant to zoom during a shot with any decent camera. If you want to change the framing mid-shot, you pan, dolly, or truck.

The percentage of major productions where you will see them zoom mid-shot is very, very small, and even then it doesn't work well in most of those cases. As a general rule, zooming while filming should be avoided always, with any camera.
Posted: Sun, 18th Jul 2010, 10:44pm

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The Nemesis2161

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right, I know, if that were to be the case then that'd be my number one prob., but the rolling shutter seems to be the biggest problem, but I'm trying out the CoreMelt FCP plugging right now, sort of working
Posted: Sun, 18th Jul 2010, 11:25pm

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Sick Boy

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^ Not to mention the "jerky- effect" while panning. That one is far more annoying then the shutter effect which either can be solved avoiding whip-pans or using wide-angle lenses in doing so.
Posted: Sun, 18th Jul 2010, 11:39pm

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Axeman

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Any jerky effect while panning comes down to not having a proper video head on your tripod, not the camera itself.

And, of course, with any video camera, or film camera, there are rules to be followed with regard to how fast you can pan and get good results.
Posted: Sun, 18th Jul 2010, 11:48pm

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Sick Boy

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I don't know Axeman. Judging from this video; http://vimeo.com/10466342 there is more to it (my Canon 550D gets the same jerky- effect as the 5D in the vid).
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 12:08am

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Aculag

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Sick Boy wrote:

I don't know Axeman. Judging from this video; http://vimeo.com/10466342 there is more to it (my Canon 550D gets the same jerky- effect as the 5D in the vid).
You've posted this a couple times, and I haven't seen the jerkiness you're talking about any of the times I've watched it. I'm wondering if you're just mistaking the 24p for being jerky? Maybe I'm just blind, but the footage from both cameras looks pretty smooth. That or it's just the playback that's slightly choppy due to performance? No idea.

Last edited Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 12:14am; edited 1 times in total.

Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 12:13am

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ben3308

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The Nemesis2161 wrote:

But seriously, it has a few major problems: can't zoom without lighting change, 12 minute clip max., has the HD 'jello' effect (number one problem with it.)
I mean, yeah, if you're not creative enough to get around - or adapt to - these issues then they're "major problems"......but for now I think the camera still yields the highest quality results for the price/form factor by FAR.

Boom.
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 1:40am

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Aculag

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You can zoom without a lighting change if you use an all manual lens. I have a Nikon lens adapter, so I can use my manual Nikkor zoom lens, and the camera doesn't have any control over it. I'm assuming this will work with any fully manual lens (non-autofocus, manually adjustable iris.)

I don't consider the 12 minute max a "problem" at all. I will never need to shoot for more than 12 minutes at a time, because the type of stuff I do never calls for that. And in the case that I ever DO need to shoot past that limit, I will use a different camera that better suits the needs of the project, which is what everyone should do. This is not an all-purpose camcorder.

And as for the rolling shutter issue, just work around it. There's also a plugin by The Foundry that will fix it if you're desperate. Stabilize your image, use quick pans sparingly, use the plugin if you really need it, and this becomes a non-issue.

So yeah, I agree with Ben. They're only "major problems" if you're unwilling to work around them.
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 2:23am

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Serpent

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I think any jerkiness you are seeing is your computer. Once it's playing on a Bluray player, or a better computer, I don't think you are going to see the same jerkiness.

I've had no problems with this camera, despite rolling shutter. 12 minute limit is a non-issue. If you need a camera rolling past that, rent a camcorder for a day. If you are an event shooter or your projects demand for longer takes, don't get (just) a T2i.

Avoid lenses with f/2.5-4.0 (a range). That's not the camera changing the aperture btw. That's the lenses aperture physically changing in size as the lenses and mechanisms move for the zoom.

And how is this hard to set up? Keep your shutter and aperture the at wide open and 50 or 60 shutter. Change it when you need to. Then adjust lighting and ISO accordingly (and white balance, when you are starting the day/shoot). ISO is the same exact thing as GAIN on a CAMCORDER, pretty much. You have to do much less work on a T2i than a camcorder. Flip it on, look at your image, change your lighting and ISO, hit record, get what you need, stop recording. Plug in camera/card, and a file transfers to your computer automatically in much less time than it would take a tape (15 minutes to transfer 2 hours of footage to my hard drive). I seriously have no idea how anyone would consider recommending a camcorder over this unless they really need to learn a bit more. It's definitely something new for some people, just learn it, the same way you learned how to do the tape camera workflow, or whatever you learned. This is filmmaking. And we now get the ability to use digital files that look like film. Film is MUCH more difficult.
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 3:27am

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The Nemesis2161

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Well, I've found ways around these problems, I consider them major problems if I ever need them not to do it and they do it, hand held shots, if you pan too quickly it does become a problem, oddly enough not always though. I don't use AE or Nuke so I'm looking into getting the rolling shutter reduction/image stabilization FCP pluggin pack by CoreMelt, hopefully it works.

Luckily, my first project I completed with it was production reel for the San Diego Museum of Contemporary art, and boy was I proud of the video wink the 550 looks fantastic!

I really disagree with the Gizmodo review that sells the product as an easy to use tool, its now easy to use for me, but when I first picked it up it was intimidating and reading online chats I don't seem to be the only one.

Thanks everyone
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 4:40am

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ben3308

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Serpent wrote:

Avoid lenses with f/2.5-4.0 (a range). That's not the camera changing the aperture btw. That's the lenses aperture physically changing in size as the lenses and mechanisms move for the zoom.
You keep mentioning this like it doesn't apply to all cameras - the same was true on my GL2 or ANY camera with aperture. I do think the mentioned problem is that the exposure ramps up and down mildly while zooming even at full auto and on a locked exposure. biggrin

Keep in mind if an f/2.5-4.0 is stopped to f/4.0 from the beginning, it shouldn't change aperture during the zoom. The T2i does some 'processing' that requires moments of a second to know to keep everything locked down during a zoom, and lenses that don't electronically connect at all to the T2i (lenses with a different mount) are going to be the only ones that bypass the ever-so-slight exposure fluctuations.
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 4:47am

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wdy

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Jerkiness of footage on your computer after capturing is more then likely your computer not keeping up with it. Right now until I upgrade I have to use a proper workflow for my 7D. Using MPEGStreamclip to export all my H.264 footage in Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) unscaled then its works seamless on my macbook pro. Proper workflow for all these HDSLR's is very important to ensure you are able to not only edit with out headaches but to maintain your quality.
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 5:22am

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Serpent

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ben3308 wrote:

Serpent wrote:

Avoid lenses with f/2.5-4.0 (a range). That's not the camera changing the aperture btw. That's the lenses aperture physically changing in size as the lenses and mechanisms move for the zoom.
You keep mentioning this like it doesn't apply to all cameras - the same was true on my GL2 or ANY camera with aperture. I do think the mentioned problem is that the exposure ramps up and down mildly while zooming even at full auto and on a locked exposure. biggrin

Keep in mind if an f/2.5-4.0 is stopped to f/4.0 from the beginning, it shouldn't change aperture during the zoom. The T2i does some 'processing' that requires moments of a second to know to keep everything locked down during a zoom, and lenses that don't electronically connect at all to the T2i (lenses with a different mount) are going to be the only ones that bypass the ever-so-slight exposure fluctuations.
I only mentioned it because he brought it up in his post... And my lenses don't have such an aperture range. Everything I've read has said to avoid these lenses for video. What happens when you set your camera to 2.5, and zoom it to a focal length that's widest aperture is 4.0? It will adjust, right? With your shutter and ISO the same, no? Maybe the people whose comments I've read have been mistaken. Really I don't know what you're saying. I'm fully aware that other cameras share that quality, but we're talking about his camera and lens. And not all zoom lenses shift aperture. Most Canons don't. Am I missing something here? If I am, inform me, this is just how I understand it from the comments I've read.


wdy!
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 5:59am

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ben3308

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I dunno, I just assumed that most people treated the slowest aperture of a zoom lens as its 'primary' aperture if they intended on zooming. However, outside of that, the T2i has a tendency to still fluctuate in exposure very slightly if Highlight Tone Priority is on - even on locked-aperture L-glass.

It is by this virtue I don't recommend getting fixed aperture lenses if you wish to zoom on a T2i, but getting lenses of an entirely different mount. Anything lens that electronically mounts in any way will conflict with zooming on the T2i. For me, I see Highlight Tone Priority as a necessity, I suppose - and I don't see zoom lenses as a particularly good investment - so getting expensive, locked-aperture L-glass isn't important.

Basically, if you use Highlight Tone Priority and zoom lenses, spending more on fixed aperture doesn't change anything. biggrin Sorry, truthfully, I assumed everyone knew, though, that if you stop a zoom lens down (with HTP off) the exposure absolutely will not change; and you don't have to buy a more expensive zoom to fix that.

EDIT:

NEVERMIND EVERYONE.

Apparently it's a bug with the firmware that flickers the aperture even when it's locked below the slowest listed setting on the lens. SO NON-FIXED APERTURE LENSES WILL FLICKER. Damn. The same 'flicker' occurs for me when shooting with Highlight Tone Priority on any lens, but likely because HTP is a stills photography function, not specifically intended for video - least of all, zooming.

A word, though, this 'bug' does NOT occur on lenses mounted to the camera body only mechanically, lacking an electronic connection. So Canon FD lenses, Nikon AIs, Olympus OM, etc will not have this issue, even on non-locked aperture zoom lenses.

My bad!
Posted: Mon, 19th Jul 2010, 7:15pm

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Atom

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Hey, wdy's back! What's up man!
Posted: Wed, 4th Aug 2010, 1:07am

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CurtinParloe

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I've had my 550D for a couple of months and shot a documentary feature on it. There are a few things I've found which don't all seem to be mentioned on this thread so far. Here's pretty much everything I know...


  • Lenses - the kit lens it pretty bad, with a lot of barrelling on the wide. Also, the focus ring isn't good for video (I could go on). Incidentally, get the best lenses you can, because they'll outlive your camera. That said, with an adaptor you can get cheap lenses on ebay which can be pretty good (I have a lovely 50mm 1.8 with an enormous focus ring which cost me less than twenty quid - unfortunately I had to borrow an adaptor of someone to try it, and the one from China still hasn't arrived). A lot of photographers seem to use the 50mm as their "workhorse" lens (a "nifty fifty"). The sensor on the 550D and 7D is 1.6X smaller, meaning that your lenses are longer (50mm x 1.6=80mm). If you wanted to do the same it's a 30mm you'd need.
  • Zooming - if you have a lens with a variable aperture then whatever your aperture setting it will flicker while zooming. According to Canon this is not a bug (they say this in the firmware update notes). The only way around it is with a fixed-aperture zoom lens.
  • Cards - SDHC 6x is really the minimum. I've managed to shoot video on a slower 4Gb card, but it doesn't always work. I'm using Fuji 8Gb cards and they hardly ever fail me.
  • overheating - This can be an issue, but I've only had it twice since I got the camera, and both times I was in a hot room with a few redheads (Cass, Mel and Kelly!).
  • Slow motion - this seems to have been an issue for all the editors who've worked with my files, because they haven't imported it properly. It took me a while to find a conversion method they like, but it involves setting up a 60fps project and slowing the clip to 15fps before exporting it into the main project...
  • editing - Avid Express Pro loves the H.264 files, conforms them to DnxHD (if memory serves) without any trouble. Premiere is a bit fussier, but Adobe Media Encoder can handle them OK (don't ask why I'm having to downconvert all the rushes to HDV - it's to do with stuff someone else shot for the project).
  • Filters - I have a UV (to protect the lens), a polarising filter (for shooting through car windows, etc), and an ND8 (which lets me open the aperture on a sunny day).
  • handheld - shooting handheld isn't bad, but using my fig-rig makes a hell of a difference.
  • rolling shutter - it isn't as bad on the 550D/7D as the 5D, because of the smaller sensor (according to a rather anal friend of mine who owns a 5D, and became rather grumpy about it).
  • batteries - battery life is good on the whole (although IS shortens this). I have a couple of HK batteries which actually outperform the Canon one - although I have yet to see whether this will continue.


The 550D does have some limitations, of course. Although these are minor things, they may influence someone's decision between a 7D and a 550D.

  • Construction - the 7D is bigger, more rugged, and weather-sealed (Although I don't think I could bring myself to use a £1500+ camera in the rain anyway!).
  • ISO Settings - the 7D has more ISO settings (intermediate ones like 160, 500, etc).
  • Colour balance - the 7D allows you to set the colour temperature in Kelvin, whereas the 550D is more like a video camera in this respect.
  • Cards - the 7D uses compactflash, which are apparently more reliable than SDHC.


Hope this is useful.
Posted: Wed, 4th Aug 2010, 5:14am

Post 38 of 39

rogolo

Force: 5436 | Joined: 29th May 2005 | Posts: 1513

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Nice list! Many of those points are on the larger/more comprehensive HDSLR thread here, but you still have some new info that hasn't been covered yet. Good to have a single list, though, instead of a bunch of decentralized info.

CurtinParloe wrote:

[*]overheating - This can be an issue, but I've only had it twice since I got the camera, and both times I was in a hot room with a few redheads (Cass, Mel and Kelly!).
Careful: When working with 3 redheads in one room, use care that you don't blow a fuse before you actually need to shoot. Could get into some sticky situations....if you have a tight shooting schedule, that is. wink
Posted: Wed, 4th Aug 2010, 9:17am

Post 39 of 39

CurtinParloe

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rogolo wrote:

Nice list! Many of those points are on the larger/more comprehensive HDSLR thread here, but you still have some new info that hasn't been covered yet. Good to have a single list, though, instead of a bunch of decentralized info.
I thought so - my comments are about the 550D specifically, so it made sense to put it all here.

Careful: When working with 3 redheads in one room, use care that you don't blow a fuse before you actually need to shoot. Could get into some sticky situations....if you have a tight shooting schedule, that is. wink
Believe me, it was uppermost in my mind.